*BONUS EPISODE* INTERVIEW: Michael Schwartz

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Hey, this is Michael Schwartz, the creator and writer of the supernatural comic series Armored, and you are listening to the Oblivion Bar podcast.

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Welcome to the Oblivion Bar podcast with your host Chris Hacker and Aaron Knowles.

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Joining me today is the screenwriter of 2017's Netflix animated film, Gnome Alone, and the 2023 adaptation of R.L.

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Stein's Zombie Town over on Hulu.

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He is also the creator slash writer of the YA supernatural comic series Armored with artist Ishmael Hernandez.

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It is my pleasure to welcome my friend Michael Schwartz onto the Oblivion Bar podcast.

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Thank you so much, Chris.

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I'm really excited to be on with you.

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Yes, so excited.

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We've been planning to do this for a while, it feels like we see each other at what, two or three comic conventions over the last two years?

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Well, I've really been, you know, checking out cons over the last year that are more international.

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You know, I'm like Toronto based, so I tend to stick to my Toronto cons or the surrounding area.

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But recently I've been expanding and I think that's where we met, maybe at WonderCon.

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probably, right?

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think San Diego, San Diego, San Diego.

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Yeah.

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Okay.

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different con.

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Yeah.

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I've been to so many recently that I can't even keep track of it anymore.

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Sure.

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You know, it's funny is two revelations happened since our initial meeting at San Diego.

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Yeah.

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2024.

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one being that I didn't know you were Canadian and I honestly didn't know until about 10 minutes ago when you said, sorry, a boot that.

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So I was like, he must be Canadian.

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Got it.

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All right.

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Yeah.

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That's the give, right?

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That was the give away.

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Ultimate tell.

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And then the second thing was how much of a horror fan you are.

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And this is something I didn't know until we became friends on social media.

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Where does that come from?

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You know, my dad used to run a video store when I was a kid.

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So I would have been like five or six and he'd be bringing home movies and he'd be recording them from the tapes at his video store or he'd buy them himself.

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They were pretty expensive then.

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So most of time he's just bootlegging them.

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Sure, as we all were.

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Yeah, exactly.

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And I don't know, you know, like he would show me like kid friendly ones, like the gate or monster squad house.

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then and then at some point I was like, I want a real horror movie.

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And I kept begging to see Poltergeist.

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And so he was like, you know what, to my mom, show Poltergeist and he'll be over this this phase.

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It'll scare him so much.

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It just made me want to see even more, man.

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It was like after that, it was like I'm fully in now.

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You've totally screwed up, Dad.

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And I was like I was six years old at that time.

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So I don't know what it is.

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I've always been attracted to horror movies and, you know, going to horror conventions and as a kid just going to the horror section and browsing the movies.

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Sure.

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Yeah, it's funny.

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It seems like all of us kids have like that Toby Hooper.

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moment, whether it's like Texas Chainsaw Massacre or Poltergeist or Salem's Lot or what have you, anything.

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And at some point you either become like a lifelong horror fan or you don't.

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And people like you and I, Michael, we are in it for forever because I had a very similar sort of upbringing where my grandmother, who I didn't see a ton growing up, but when I did see her, was often we were watching some kind of horror film.

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A lot of times I remember like going to her house and we would just sit on the couch and watch AMC.

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and just watch whatever horror film or whatever drama, you know, like a, I don't even know.

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I'm trying to think of it.

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Like the fugitive, some kind of Harrison Ford, you know, crime drama from the nineties.

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We would just watch whatever that was.

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And it, it brewed this love of, those two genres within me.

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And like to this day, you know, speaking on like the, you're, you're lucky because you had a family member that worked at a video store.

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The few times that I was lucky enough to be taken to like a blockbuster or a family video on a Friday night.

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I've got like and I have them here next to me.

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I have the blu rays.

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I have like the night of the demon.

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You know, like the VHS is I have those covers like cigarette burned into my brain.

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It was like it was this one.

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And then like Tales from the Crypt Demon Knight are two of my cult classic 90s horror.

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I don't even know.

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Could you even consider like a 90s horror film, a cult quote unquote cult classic?

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for sure.

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Absolutely.

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Yeah.

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Yeah.

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Yeah.

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Those two like.

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those two stuck with me and it also showed me that like horror can wear many faces to sort of have a pun in a way.

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Like the horror genre is fluid and sort of flexible in a lot of really cool ways.

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Well, there's so many sub genres of of it, you know.

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But yeah, I'm the same, you know, like I was very fortunate because my dad did manage like.

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a chain of them, but he would have the video store posters sent to our house.

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So we had boxes and boxes of posters.

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At some point he got rid of a lot of them, but I kept six boxes with tightly like rolled posters and I still have those to this day.

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And this sort of ties into your origin story of armored, which I want to get to eventually, but I want to hear more about this.

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What I'm sort of hinting at.

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I've heard you tell the story before about how there was a moment where you were about to get out of comics, right?

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my God.

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Yeah.

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Like that's the other thing.

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My dad is a huge comic book collector.

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since I was young, before I was born, he was collecting comics and like, you know, even when he was a kid, he was buying comics.

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But I think at some point he kind of got out of it and then really got into it in the eighties again.

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And when I was a kid, he was giving me books all the time.

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And, and then I got, you know, I was always collecting.

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And then when I went to university, I started my own My dad was still getting my pull list from back home, but then I started my own pull list with mostly DC comics in the early 2000s.

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then, yeah, when my wife and I had our second kid, someone broke into our garage one night and they took everything.

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I had just moved.

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into a house and I had moved all my comics out of storage.

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was like, yes, I'm back into it again.

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Like I'm fully going to have a pull list at the local shop.

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And I did.

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And then when I was cleaning all, basically the room I was keeping the books in, I put them into the garage and someone broke in that night.

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They stole posters I had stored in there.

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Most of the posters I didn't really care about.

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not a huge loss, but they stole toys.

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They stole winter gear.

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They stole my wife's American girl dolls.

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Now she still is upset about, know, like it.

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It was pretty gut wrenching, like having all of our stuff from our childhood just completely stolen and we didn't get back.

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Yeah.

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That's basically the story.

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at some point within that year after, I was walking into comic shops and being like, I really want that Jim Lee X-Men one back.

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I really want the McFarlane run of Spidey back.

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And then I found a pawn shop up the street that sells every comic for 50 cents.

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and was like, you know what, that's pretty cheap.

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can do 50 cents.

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And then- starting ground right here.

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And now I have way too many boxes, way too many boxes of comics.

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And it's not just the pawn shops.

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It's like comic shops nearby.

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They have great, like, there's cheap bins.

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I'm a big fan of dollar bins and 50 cent bins.

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And man, when I see those, I go straight to them.

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I'm like, what can I find?

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Yeah.

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You have just described my happy place.

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It's like, if you, if I- If I could die in like a moment, like if you could just like put me in a bot, like put my memory and my consciousness into a bottle and place it in a memory, it would be either me looking through like a long box of like 50 cent comics or like browsing $2 Blu-rays at like a buy sell trade place.

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know, like I'm, I'm just like perusing through hangover to and avatar DVDs over and over and over again forever.

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Yeah.

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Well, and to sort of speak on what you're saying there too, you you mentioned Tom McFarlane there and the last time that we saw each other was actually at the Harvey Awards this year at New York Comic-Con.

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And we were there supporting our friends, Brad and Lisa, the couple's counseling.

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And you had a, I didn't have this chance.

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actually witnessed you go up and talk to Tom McFarlane there at the show.

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didn't, you like I envied you and Jeremy, Jeremy Snow of the Greek Giggly Grind, good friend of the show as well.

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I envied both of you because you both had the right mind to go up and like, Go and talk to Todd, go talk to the Todd father, go talk to, cause we were sitting actually with the editor in chief of, shoot, who was it?

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The two women that were sitting at our table.

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I'm forgetting, they accepted the award for Mariko Tamaki's roaming.

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know the Montreal company, the Montreal publishing company.

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it'll come to me here in a moment.

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anyway, point being is that you guys both went up and said hi to Todd and you're like taking photos with him.

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I'm like, man.

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because by this time he had seven people around him.

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And I want to get kind of your thoughts on it.

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What was that moment for you?

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mentioned, you know, Todd was sort of a catalyst for getting you back into comics.

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What was that moment finally getting to be him at the Harvey's?

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You know, I grew up on McFarland books like that.

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To me, it was like I remember on my pull list, the first books I had were were Hulk and Silver Surfer.

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But then eventually it was his Spidey series.

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And then I immediately, you know, within a few years graduated to spawn.

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I was probably too young for it, but I was obsessed with McFarland.

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So I actually met him the first time at WonderCon.

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And that was this year as well, 2024.

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I was talking to, I think it was Tim Sheridan.

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I'm just having a conversation with Tim.

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And then he goes, that's McFarland.

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And McFarland was just wandering around.

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And then I was like, I have to leave Tim and I left.

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ditched Tim.

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Tim hold that thought.

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Hold that thought and went straight to McFarland and because no one was around him and I was just like, hey, I'm a huge fan.

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That was the first time I had met him and I was just, you know, it's meeting an idol, right?

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Like, and I really respect the guy a lot, like just his business sense, you know, not just.

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his artist, his art as well, but also like who he is as a person.

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He takes time for everybody.

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So I don't know how late you were there at the Harvey Awards, but Todd stayed till, I think it was 1.30, two o'clock in the morning.

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think Brad told me that you guys walked out with him.

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We walked out with Todd, but Brad and I were just chatting.

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I was chatting to, we were chatting with a bunch of people like Matt Bors, who does the Toxic Avenger book.

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And then, you know, we're realizing, it's pretty late.

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you know, we better go, but it's like Todd's still there.

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We cannot be here.

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We cannot leave before time.

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All We basically closed the place down with him.

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So yeah, if you, at some point I think I posted it on Twitter, he even took my phone because I was telling him a friend of mine used to live down the street from where he actually, my friend lives down the street from where he grew up or Todd grew up in Canada.

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And he's like, where's your friend?

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Why isn't he here?

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And I was like, well, he couldn't come, you know, whatever.

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And he's like, give me your phone.

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I'll record something for him.

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And that's cool.

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He knows how important he is.

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And like you said, he's a total he is a champion of the medium.

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He understands how important comics are because he was a fan at one point.

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And that's never left him through again, through all his business success and and all the McFarland toys and the movies and everything that he's been able to sort of bring into his career.

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He's never forgotten how important the medium is, which is.

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So evident when you hear him talk and just the things that he does with his career, even today.

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Totally.

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And he keeps the books at a very low cost because he believes in the medium.

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Absolutely.

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I have one more horror based question for you before we get into Armored.

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OK, so because I don't we don't talk to a ton of people who are like in the horror.

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And I'm not saying that I'm like a horror file, like a play on cine file.

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Like I like horror, but I'm not like an expert in it.

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OK, we actually good friend of the show and.

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face of our rating system, David Weiner, who did the search of darkness documentaries over on shutter.

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Yeah, that's great.

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Fantastic docs.

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Yeah.

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We just talked to him.

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We've talked to him many times on the show, but we recently had him on the show.

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And it was about a month ago talking about in search of darkness, 90 through 94.

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And he and I were talking off camera about what movies we were going to check out leading up to Halloween.

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And he mentioned this like horror fest idea that he and his, his, his friends do.

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where they basically take three rules and they base their watch list off of these rules.

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So my partner and I, Olivia and I, we decided to create our own horror fest for this year.

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it's basically, it's a, film has to be a horror film from the seventies.

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One has to be either a Wes Craven film or a Michelle Savalli film.

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That's our director spotlight.

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And then one has to be a foreign horror film.

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And then after we watch each of our entries, we end it with, we call it our final kill, which is with hereditary in 2018.

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So I wanted to list a couple of these films and tell me if you've seen them or if you think they're good choices.

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Yeah.

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Okay.

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Let's do it.

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Let's do it.

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Okay.

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All right.

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So the first one was, one of my picks was 1971, see no evil, Richard Fleischer.

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Yeah.

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Yeah.

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Mia Farrow in that one.

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That's great.

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Yeah.

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Yeah.

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my other pick was speak no evil, which is the, that was the 2000 and 22 film.

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I think it's a Dutch film originally that was remade this year with shoot, I'm now I'm spacing who was all in the new one, but Have you seen speak new evil?

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No, you actually got me with one.

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haven't seen okay I don't know why I'm spacing who's in the who's in the new one But then my last pick was Cemetery Man the 1994 film.

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That's the Savalli film.

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Have you seen that one?

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You literally just picked one of my all time favorite films like no kidding it's no kidding for me.

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Yeah.

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Yeah.

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I'm a huge fan of that film.

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Delamore Delamore.

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Yeah.

00:14:32.149 --> 00:14:32.538
Yes.

00:14:32.538 --> 00:14:33.190
Yes.

00:14:33.190 --> 00:14:49.363
Can you tell me really quick because my partner and were watching this and I'm like this movie is insane and and I mean that in like a very respectful way but also in like I like a pink question mark above my head like an anime question mark.

00:14:49.363 --> 00:14:50.784
What is this movie?

00:14:50.784 --> 00:14:52.184
What's going on here?

00:14:52.716 --> 00:14:54.878
I know it's pretty surreal, right?

00:14:54.878 --> 00:15:05.517
it's pretty linear and straightforward, you know, movie about a man who runs a cemetery and his strange, like, do call him?

00:15:05.517 --> 00:15:07.979
Gravedigger friend, Nuggy.

00:15:08.899 --> 00:15:15.306
And then at some point he falls in love with a woman and then she dies and then a new version of her shows up.

00:15:15.306 --> 00:15:17.727
It's just so, it's so surreal.

00:15:17.727 --> 00:15:19.408
There's no through line.

00:15:20.159 --> 00:15:24.812
It's so beautiful though, like the music, the visuals, everything about it.

00:15:24.812 --> 00:15:25.942
I absolutely love it.

00:15:25.942 --> 00:15:42.419
Like to me, it's like, I'm not a huge art house film guy, but to me it like balances that like, it walks that fine line of being like, I'm an artsy artsy film and I'm also this like ridiculous horror movie that makes no sense.

00:15:42.419 --> 00:15:43.840
Sure, sure.

00:15:43.980 --> 00:15:48.256
I need to give another watch because we were watching it and my partner and I were like, What is going on?

00:15:48.256 --> 00:15:50.138
like, cause I even said the same thing to her.

00:15:50.138 --> 00:15:53.039
was like, I'm liking what's happening here, but I I don't know.

00:15:53.039 --> 00:15:54.245
It's, don't, I don't get it.

00:15:54.245 --> 00:15:56.212
I'm I'm not understanding it.

00:15:56.212 --> 00:16:02.226
So in the nineties, when I first saw it, like I saw it on VHS, I watched that thing over and over and over.

00:16:02.226 --> 00:16:04.778
I don't know if it's because of the, actress, what's her name?

00:16:04.778 --> 00:16:11.614
Anna Fulci, I think is her name or something, but you know, the teen hormones want, sure.

00:16:11.614 --> 00:16:14.830
Watching it quite frequently, but man, that was a, that was.

00:16:14.830 --> 00:16:17.889
It was such a pivotal movie for me.

00:16:17.889 --> 00:16:18.230
Yeah.

00:16:18.230 --> 00:16:22.269
Well, you know, to go back really quickly, we talked about Nine of the Demons Part Two.

00:16:22.269 --> 00:16:25.809
That movie was so integral to my love of horror.

00:16:25.809 --> 00:16:31.169
was actually, man, I think it's Zoe Thrilling in that film.

00:16:31.169 --> 00:16:32.470
She's like the mean girl.

00:16:32.470 --> 00:16:34.669
I don't know if you've seen Nine of the Demons Part Two.

00:16:34.669 --> 00:16:36.269
Years ago.

00:16:36.529 --> 00:16:37.389
That one didn't stick.

00:16:37.389 --> 00:16:41.809
See, I didn't see that one as like a kid, so I feel like it didn't really stick with me.

00:16:41.809 --> 00:16:42.230
Sure.

00:16:42.230 --> 00:16:42.470
Sure.

00:16:42.470 --> 00:16:44.309
And it's not incredible.

00:16:44.309 --> 00:16:45.345
Like that's what I'm saying.

00:16:45.345 --> 00:16:46.020
It's like part two.

00:16:46.020 --> 00:16:46.691
It's not.

00:16:46.691 --> 00:16:51.662
It is part two of a low budget, terrible horror series.

00:16:51.662 --> 00:16:52.863
But there's something about it.

00:16:52.863 --> 00:16:53.212
I don't know.

00:16:53.212 --> 00:16:56.773
Again, it just cigarette brain or cigarette burned into my brain.

00:16:56.793 --> 00:17:00.254
But to go on to this horror fest and I promise you, we'll get into armored.

00:17:01.054 --> 00:17:04.755
So we have 1973's Don't Look Now.

00:17:04.755 --> 00:17:06.836
So you another favorite of mine.

00:17:06.836 --> 00:17:09.096
My wife and I actually like we both love that movie.

00:17:09.096 --> 00:17:11.797
We went to some of the shooting locations in Venice.

00:17:11.880 --> 00:17:12.609
no kidding.

00:17:12.609 --> 00:17:13.769
Two years ago.

00:17:13.769 --> 00:17:14.529
Yeah.

00:17:14.529 --> 00:17:14.730
all right.

00:17:14.730 --> 00:17:17.490
Peter the great Donald Sutherland just passed away a couple of months ago.

00:17:17.490 --> 00:17:17.900
Man.

00:17:17.900 --> 00:17:18.289
OK.

00:17:18.289 --> 00:17:20.369
And then up next, classic.

00:17:20.369 --> 00:17:21.829
Everyone's seen this one.

00:17:21.829 --> 00:17:23.700
1984 is a nightmare on Elm Street.

00:17:23.700 --> 00:17:25.309
Had to include one of the classics.

00:17:25.309 --> 00:17:26.650
That was her Wes Craven pick.

00:17:26.650 --> 00:17:30.430
And then we ended it with 1999's audition.

00:17:30.710 --> 00:17:30.930
yeah.

00:17:30.930 --> 00:17:31.720
Fantastic films.

00:17:31.720 --> 00:17:32.039
Yeah.

00:17:32.039 --> 00:17:34.730
I to get the I need to get the criterion for that one.

00:17:34.730 --> 00:17:37.675
But anyway, everybody, like I said, I just wanted to pick.

00:17:37.675 --> 00:17:41.048
Michael's brain on that because I was sort of proud of us for creating that.

00:17:41.048 --> 00:17:45.211
then Hereditary, Hereditary is actually my favorite horror film of all time.

00:17:45.332 --> 00:17:45.952
it's a great one.

00:17:45.952 --> 00:17:46.713
I love it.

00:17:46.713 --> 00:17:48.115
I don't even know if that's a hot take or not.

00:17:48.115 --> 00:17:53.718
My girlfriend didn't love it as much as I do, but I stand by it that that film is a masterpiece in my opinion.

00:17:53.718 --> 00:17:54.259
It's great.

00:17:54.259 --> 00:17:55.029
It's fantastic.

00:17:55.029 --> 00:17:55.760
I love it.

00:17:55.760 --> 00:17:56.561
I like it as well.

00:17:56.561 --> 00:17:58.692
One of the great modern horror films.

00:17:58.692 --> 00:17:59.203
Yeah.

00:17:59.203 --> 00:18:00.384
Yeah, absolutely.

00:18:00.384 --> 00:18:06.539
OK, so everybody speaking of horror and it's actually the main reason why I have Michael here today outside of just chatting.

00:18:06.539 --> 00:18:08.820
with my friend is that we want to talk about armored.

00:18:08.820 --> 00:18:09.352
Okay.

00:18:09.352 --> 00:18:13.034
Now armored is your Kickstarter supernatural.

00:18:13.034 --> 00:18:26.040
And I call it YA, but maybe you can categorize it as something else because I feel like you could hand this to, you know, a, to 14 year old and they could enjoy it as much as a 33 year old can tell the folks at home.

00:18:26.040 --> 00:18:27.082
People are listening right now.

00:18:27.082 --> 00:18:29.443
How would you describe armored just sort of in a nutshell?

00:18:29.443 --> 00:18:29.784
Yeah.

00:18:29.784 --> 00:18:32.224
You know, I think it can be classified as YA.

00:18:32.224 --> 00:18:34.105
I don't want that to scare away.

00:18:34.112 --> 00:18:42.044
adults because I think right now my primary audience is adults, but it is like kind of the weird all ages book, all ages to a point, right?

00:18:42.044 --> 00:18:49.465
Like, you know, I would say eight and up, but yeah, Armored is the story about a boy.

00:18:49.465 --> 00:18:58.538
He's this orphan boy who ends up being adopted by the strange couple who lost their son, who would have been the exact same age as him.

00:18:58.538 --> 00:19:02.781
Their son passed away years ago and now they've adopted him.

00:19:02.781 --> 00:19:15.853
And within the first few days of living with this couple, he ends up being drawn to this castle where the boy who he's sort of replacing within the family died.

00:19:15.853 --> 00:19:24.987
And he goes to this castle and he ends up falling into this tomb where he finds a medieval suit of armor and it's being haunted by the knight that used to wear it like centuries ago.

00:19:24.987 --> 00:19:33.721
Yeah, and so the knight ends up having to train him how to use this armor because it has kind of magical powers.

00:19:33.875 --> 00:19:41.352
and also help him kind of solve the mystery as to what happened to this kid and who's behind the death.

00:19:41.692 --> 00:19:49.078
Yeah, and the idea is that this would be like an ongoing series, but you know, we're gonna do it in like chapters kind of like Hellboy used to do it.

00:19:49.799 --> 00:20:01.769
I'd say it's more ongoing than like the story is more continuous, more serialized than Hellboy was, but you know, the first five issues were kickstarted.

00:20:02.086 --> 00:20:04.646
And so many people have read the whole series already.

00:20:04.646 --> 00:20:08.108
You're one of the few people have read it already.

00:20:08.108 --> 00:20:12.630
But issue five comes to comic shops December 18th.

00:20:12.630 --> 00:20:13.411
Yeah.

00:20:13.411 --> 00:20:17.872
And then that'll be the first chapter of armored and it ends on a big cliffhanger.

00:20:17.872 --> 00:20:18.532
Yeah.

00:20:18.532 --> 00:20:20.103
Yeah, it absolutely does.

00:20:20.103 --> 00:20:24.454
And everyone that's listening right now, if you're listening to us right now, is like this.

00:20:24.454 --> 00:20:25.234
It should.

00:20:25.234 --> 00:20:31.736
I would imagine this this conversation comes out before the 18th, but for some reason, if it's not, I will include the link in the show notes for how you can.

00:20:31.736 --> 00:20:34.037
how you can find Armored or find more information on Armored.

00:20:34.037 --> 00:20:36.938
But I want to talk a little bit about like Andy as a character.

00:20:36.938 --> 00:20:43.249
Now I've heard you talk about before in other conversations how you sort of came up with this story.

00:20:43.609 --> 00:20:44.942
You know, I'm going to backtrack a little bit.

00:20:44.942 --> 00:20:46.039
I don't want to get to Andy quite yet.

00:20:46.039 --> 00:20:48.790
I want to actually, I want to stick to the creation of the story.

00:20:48.790 --> 00:20:52.902
So this is like you said, it's been Kickstarter through Kickstarter.

00:20:52.902 --> 00:20:55.032
It's been crowdfunded through Kickstarter, I should say.

00:20:55.032 --> 00:20:57.683
And with an association with Clover Press.

00:20:57.683 --> 00:21:01.442
Now can I ask you, What's the relationship there with Clover Press?

00:21:01.442 --> 00:21:04.093
So Clover is the publisher of Armored.

00:21:04.093 --> 00:21:07.154
So they kickstart everything.

00:21:07.154 --> 00:21:10.817
That's kind of their model is just kickstarting every single book.

00:21:10.817 --> 00:21:17.069
that they ran it, Like they understand Kickstarter.

00:21:17.069 --> 00:21:21.083
They totally know the ins and outs of that world.

00:21:21.083 --> 00:21:22.874
I've backed a few books here and there.

00:21:22.874 --> 00:21:27.115
I get a lot of art books through Kickstarter, but I've never really...

00:21:27.521 --> 00:21:29.874
been one to be interested in even kickstarting book.

00:21:29.874 --> 00:21:36.670
My big thing when I signed with Clover was, hey, I want this to be single issues.

00:21:36.670 --> 00:21:38.611
And they're like, really?

00:21:39.422 --> 00:21:42.375
And I was like, yeah, that's what I collect.

00:21:42.375 --> 00:21:45.527
don't buy, like you have a ton of trade behind you, right?

00:21:45.527 --> 00:21:47.239
You have graphic You're dirty trade waiter.

00:21:47.239 --> 00:21:49.099
Yeah, I don't.

00:21:49.121 --> 00:21:53.324
I have boxes and boxes, long boxes, short boxes of comics.

00:21:53.324 --> 00:21:55.925
And I was like, I really want this to be.

00:21:56.034 --> 00:21:57.074
a single issue series.

00:21:57.074 --> 00:22:00.856
I've written it so that it ends on a huge cliffhanger every issue.

00:22:01.953 --> 00:22:04.260
I think I've gone too forward now.

00:22:04.260 --> 00:22:06.902
You wanted to go back and I brought you, but yeah.

00:22:07.363 --> 00:22:08.173
No, I love it.

00:22:08.173 --> 00:22:14.989
Well, I guess my next question would be, has there been any like true perks of doing it via Kickstarter?

00:22:14.989 --> 00:22:17.541
are there any obvious perks that you can think of?

00:22:17.541 --> 00:22:21.153
And I know this is your first time writing and publishing a comic.

00:22:21.153 --> 00:22:25.869
I'm sure it won't be the last, but I'm just curious, like, are there any obvious perks to going through?

00:22:25.869 --> 00:22:27.530
through a crowdfunding option?

00:22:27.530 --> 00:22:30.551
think there's more of a direct link with the reader.

00:22:30.551 --> 00:22:33.163
Like I get messages directly from people.

00:22:33.163 --> 00:22:40.566
The problem is, is I feel like because I'm an unknown entity, I don't see like tons, like there wasn't a ton of people talking about the book.

00:22:40.566 --> 00:22:48.019
It was a lot of people like directly like adding me on Instagram and then wanting to talk to me about the book that way, which has been really cool.

00:22:48.019 --> 00:22:54.201
So there's like a really clear direct link to the fans of the book who were there from the beginning.

00:22:55.082 --> 00:23:05.368
Whereas with comic shop release, you're getting like a wide like range of people where I'm like, wow, that, you know, I didn't know this person was picking it up.

00:23:05.368 --> 00:23:06.200
That's really cool.

00:23:06.200 --> 00:23:07.721
Like, so it's very different.

00:23:07.721 --> 00:23:10.673
I feel like you can connect in a certain way.

00:23:10.673 --> 00:23:12.314
Also, there's there's more rewards.

00:23:12.314 --> 00:23:16.737
Like, I don't know if we would have done as many variant covers if we just went straight to comic shops.

00:23:16.737 --> 00:23:17.917
We probably wouldn't have.

00:23:17.917 --> 00:23:18.258
Sure.

00:23:18.258 --> 00:23:20.378
So it allowed us to do a lot more.

00:23:20.419 --> 00:23:20.920
Yeah.

00:23:20.920 --> 00:23:23.932
And speaking of those variant covers, let's go through some of them right now.

00:23:23.932 --> 00:23:30.633
We got And this is an incredible, I have to give you major props, incredible list of creators that have provided variants for this series.

00:23:30.633 --> 00:23:37.078
You've got Jay Lee, David Mack, Becky Clunin, Trevor Henderson, Jeff Dixon, and Matthew Theron.

00:23:37.078 --> 00:23:38.641
Now am I saying that correctly Theron?

00:23:38.641 --> 00:23:39.521
Terian actually.

00:23:39.521 --> 00:23:40.574
Terian, excuse me, sorry.

00:23:40.574 --> 00:23:41.304
Matthew Terian.

00:23:41.304 --> 00:23:43.165
And there's more, there's more.

00:23:43.165 --> 00:23:43.946
There's more.

00:23:43.946 --> 00:23:45.867
I also have Scott Collins.

00:23:46.048 --> 00:23:47.690
Did you say Chrissy Zullo?

00:23:47.817 --> 00:23:48.468
No, I didn't.

00:23:48.468 --> 00:23:49.009
I saw the Chris.

00:23:49.009 --> 00:23:49.919
Is that issue three?

00:23:49.919 --> 00:23:53.401
Chris is a low issue to shoot a Kickstarter exclusive for us.

00:23:53.401 --> 00:23:53.681
Yeah.

00:23:53.681 --> 00:23:54.020
Nice.

00:23:54.020 --> 00:23:54.582
Love Chris.

00:23:54.582 --> 00:23:58.804
She's very frequent in the in the the concert.

00:23:58.804 --> 00:23:59.013
yeah.

00:23:59.013 --> 00:23:59.294
Yeah.

00:23:59.294 --> 00:24:08.819
And then also Nick Patera, who does like actually John and he did the Jonathan Hickman series, Manhattan Projects.

00:24:08.819 --> 00:24:09.470
Yeah.

00:24:09.470 --> 00:24:09.990
Yeah.

00:24:09.990 --> 00:24:10.871
Wow.

00:24:10.871 --> 00:24:11.601
How does this happen?

00:24:11.601 --> 00:24:15.093
Is this through Clover or do you talk to these creators at cons or OK?

00:24:15.093 --> 00:24:18.913
Well, with like When I started out, I didn't know anything.

00:24:18.913 --> 00:24:21.066
I hired an editor actually.

00:24:21.066 --> 00:24:24.989
was like hire an editor and then he helped me find Ishmael, hire Ishmael.

00:24:24.989 --> 00:24:28.311
Which is Chris Stevens, correct?

00:24:28.311 --> 00:24:30.913
Yeah, Chris Stevens is the editor.

00:24:30.913 --> 00:24:33.415
Chris has been in the industry for a long time.

00:24:33.415 --> 00:24:34.586
He used to own a comic shop.

00:24:34.586 --> 00:24:36.659
He's edited tons of books.

00:24:36.659 --> 00:24:38.411
Legend.

00:24:38.411 --> 00:24:43.994
And so Chris has just such a good relationship with so many artists.

00:24:43.994 --> 00:24:45.246
They all love him.

00:24:45.364 --> 00:24:48.215
I love the guy.

00:24:48.215 --> 00:24:50.894
you know, at first I was like, I don't know what I'm doing.

00:24:50.894 --> 00:24:52.147
I don't want to spend a lot of money.

00:24:52.147 --> 00:24:53.336
I'm like really nervous.

00:24:53.336 --> 00:24:55.599
This is, you know, what do I do?

00:24:55.599 --> 00:24:59.701
But then once like, I didn't know how to get a publisher.

00:24:59.721 --> 00:25:04.473
He really just, it was like really hard because I was like, where do I go with this?

00:25:04.473 --> 00:25:09.727
And he, he literally sent it to the Clover and I just loved how much Hank Canals there.

00:25:09.846 --> 00:25:11.647
Love the project.

00:25:11.949 --> 00:25:17.086
Like you're so passionate about Armored that I was like, I gotta go with this company.

00:25:17.086 --> 00:25:19.208
They understand what I wanna do.

00:25:20.269 --> 00:25:25.932
But then when it came time, like now that I had a publisher, I was like, okay, I need some like cover artists and stuff.

00:25:25.932 --> 00:25:42.498
And I went straight to Scott Collins just because I consider his run on The Flash with Geoff Johns to be a pivotal moment, not only in my collecting, but like just providing me with such inspiration for writing movies and TV shows and stuff that I was pitching.

00:25:42.498 --> 00:25:44.769
that I was like, I gotta reach out to him.

00:25:44.769 --> 00:25:46.991
And he was totally on board immediately.

00:25:46.991 --> 00:25:53.807
Nick was someone that Chris was working with on Axe Wielder John.

00:25:54.248 --> 00:25:58.290
And he was like, I wanna do covers for you as well after reading it.

00:25:58.290 --> 00:25:59.692
So it was just a lot of that.

00:25:59.692 --> 00:26:04.077
And then when it came time, Clover's like, can we get a heavy hit or two?

00:26:04.195 --> 00:26:06.897
Chris works with Jay Lee all the time.

00:26:06.897 --> 00:26:09.039
And Jay came on board.

00:26:09.039 --> 00:26:10.510
That's basically how it happened.

00:26:10.510 --> 00:26:11.662
And then Chris started.

00:26:11.662 --> 00:26:16.402
recommending other people and yeah, it was crazy.

00:26:16.541 --> 00:26:23.701
still like, I sometimes have to pinch myself and be like, I got like David Mack.

00:26:23.701 --> 00:26:24.442
What's happening?

00:26:24.442 --> 00:26:31.241
There are not many people in the comic world that can say they got David Mack on David Mack cover for their first series.

00:26:31.241 --> 00:26:33.061
So that is a feat within itself.

00:26:33.061 --> 00:26:33.662
Totally.

00:26:33.662 --> 00:26:34.711
I agree.

00:26:34.711 --> 00:26:36.758
I'm like, I could probably retire now.

00:26:36.758 --> 00:26:38.578
from comics and be happy.

00:26:38.598 --> 00:26:39.259
But I won't.

00:26:39.259 --> 00:26:42.181
Just warning people, I'm not stopping.

00:26:42.261 --> 00:26:46.654
Okay, so I know the answer here, but I'm going to set you up to describe this scenario.

00:26:46.654 --> 00:26:57.342
So for the listener here, so you have a pull quote from not only Dan Aykroy, an original Ghostbuster, but also one of the creators of a lot of our childhoods, which was R.L.

00:26:57.342 --> 00:26:58.292
Stine.

00:26:58.413 --> 00:27:05.536
Tell the folks at home how you were able to get in contact with those two legends and how you got armored in their hands.

00:27:05.536 --> 00:27:14.288
Yeah, so we I was a co-writer on a movie which you introduced me as the writer on was a zombie town.

00:27:14.288 --> 00:27:23.971
It was an Arl Stein book that not a lot of people know about I don't think but we shot that movie up here in Canada in a town called Sudbury which is like an old mining town.

00:27:25.491 --> 00:27:31.673
And while on set I got to you know hang out with Dan Aykroyd.

00:27:31.673 --> 00:27:38.226
So but like you know He knew who I was and he'd come looking for me on set being like, where's Michael?

00:27:38.226 --> 00:27:40.636
need to tell him I want to change the line or whatever.

00:27:40.958 --> 00:27:41.978
But I didn't know him personally.

00:27:41.978 --> 00:27:43.659
Like I don't go out for dinner or anything with them.

00:27:43.659 --> 00:27:46.359
I was hanging out with him at two in the morning on set.

00:27:46.861 --> 00:27:48.852
And then, yeah, exactly.

00:27:48.852 --> 00:27:50.373
And then R.L.

00:27:50.373 --> 00:27:53.875
Stine, he was supposed to be in the movie, but then couldn't make it up.

00:27:53.875 --> 00:27:58.807
So we had to figure out a way to shoot like a cameo for him over Zoom.

00:27:58.807 --> 00:28:03.750
So I got to meet him over Zoom and he was just so supportive of the movie.

00:28:04.097 --> 00:28:10.163
But then a year later, Clover is ramping up to do the Kickstarter.

00:28:10.163 --> 00:28:14.101
And they're like, hey, can you get any pull quotes or anything just in support of the book?

00:28:14.101 --> 00:28:19.462
And I was like, well, I could send it to Dan Aykroyd's assistant and see what happens.

00:28:19.462 --> 00:28:21.357
And so I messaged her.

00:28:21.357 --> 00:28:23.804
And she's like, I'll see if he's interested.

00:28:23.817 --> 00:28:25.964
And I guess she sent it off.

00:28:25.964 --> 00:28:27.165
I didn't hear anything.

00:28:27.165 --> 00:28:28.627
And then I...

00:28:28.627 --> 00:28:36.897
I had tagged Arl Stein in a picture of me and him, him on a computer screen and me and the director of the movie, the three of us together.

00:28:36.897 --> 00:28:38.926
And he just said, sorry, I couldn't be there.

00:28:38.926 --> 00:28:40.868
And I was like, well, he did respond to that message.

00:28:40.868 --> 00:28:43.131
Maybe he'll respond to me on Instagram.

00:28:43.131 --> 00:28:43.938
And he did.

00:28:43.938 --> 00:28:51.417
all I said was, know, Bob, would you be willing to read my comic?

00:28:51.417 --> 00:28:52.999
I have the first issue.

00:28:53.038 --> 00:28:58.209
he was like, all he wrote back was, here's my address, send it to my address.

00:28:58.209 --> 00:29:01.281
And I was like, first of all, this is incredible.

00:29:01.281 --> 00:29:02.843
But second of all, it's not printed yet.

00:29:02.843 --> 00:29:03.383
What do I do?

00:29:03.383 --> 00:29:08.106
I'm not telling Stein, sorry, here's a PDF.

00:29:08.106 --> 00:29:09.778
He told me to send him a hard copy.

00:29:09.778 --> 00:29:12.500
So Clover got a few copies made.

00:29:12.500 --> 00:29:15.442
I call it the Stein variant because it's like really early.

00:29:15.442 --> 00:29:17.633
It was only four copies made.

00:29:17.814 --> 00:29:20.635
And we sent it to Stein.

00:29:20.635 --> 00:29:22.297
And then I didn't hear anything for weeks.

00:29:22.297 --> 00:29:26.118
And we were like, This Kickstarter is about to launch.

00:29:26.720 --> 00:29:27.441
Got anything?

00:29:27.441 --> 00:29:34.326
And then literally out of nowhere, they both dropped the same week and I was just like, what?

00:29:34.446 --> 00:29:38.179
I got these quotes from these, you know, my heroes, right?

00:29:38.179 --> 00:29:41.511
Like, and I was so happy that they liked it.

00:29:41.771 --> 00:29:43.723
So that's kind of the story there.

00:29:43.723 --> 00:29:46.205
That is extremely impressive.

00:29:46.205 --> 00:29:47.897
And I have to commend you.

00:29:47.897 --> 00:29:54.162
I have to give you major kudos again for the amount that you are often promoting armored.

00:29:54.173 --> 00:29:57.277
And rightfully so, it is a really fun read.

00:29:57.277 --> 00:30:05.103
like, you are, and I mean this like in the best way possible, you are relentless with putting out armor there into the world.

00:30:05.103 --> 00:30:11.367
Like I don't know anybody in the comic world that sells their work as hard as you do.

00:30:11.367 --> 00:30:19.775
And it gets a true testament to your work ethic with your work, but also for you as like someone who is, you know, really proud of what they've done with this story.

00:30:19.954 --> 00:30:23.750
Yeah, I have to say, it's probably the one thing I'm most proud of.

00:30:23.750 --> 00:30:28.653
Like and I really believe in it and I really want to keep writing more issues of it.

00:30:28.653 --> 00:30:36.450
Like that's the thing I Really want to tell this full story So I'm not gonna stop like I really want people to read it.

00:30:36.450 --> 00:30:42.574
I always tell people, know message me on social media I'll send you the first issue you want you want a free copy of the first issue PDF.

00:30:42.574 --> 00:30:43.404
I'll send it.

00:30:43.404 --> 00:30:53.299
Yeah You know, if people paid for the PDF of issue one, I'll send you a free copy of issue two or whatever, you know, like I really, really, really believe in it.

00:30:53.299 --> 00:30:57.981
And I want I have yet to have someone read it that hasn't liked it.

00:30:57.981 --> 00:31:01.682
Like even if it's not really their thing, they'll still be like, hey, that was pretty good read.

00:31:01.742 --> 00:31:04.433
So I just want people to read it, man.

00:31:04.433 --> 00:31:07.414
Like I it's really hard to get people to read comics.

00:31:07.414 --> 00:31:12.182
I've discovered and really, it's really hard to get people to just check out your thing.

00:31:12.182 --> 00:31:16.556
whatever your creative thing is in 2024, I totally agree with you.

00:31:16.556 --> 00:31:20.670
But I've been fortunate because the two movie, I've written a ton of movies.

00:31:20.670 --> 00:31:25.253
When you're a screenwriter of feature films, you write a lot of movies and they just don't get made.

00:31:25.595 --> 00:31:29.238
But I've been fortunate that two of my movies have been on streaming services.

00:31:29.238 --> 00:31:37.675
And with No Malone, it's one of the most watched kids movies I'm sure they have on their platform because there's not a signing.

00:31:37.801 --> 00:31:41.143
I've done where I haven't met kids that are like, that's my favorite movie ever.

00:31:41.143 --> 00:31:46.433
meet kids that have it on their phone that are like, I just have it permanently on my phone.

00:31:46.433 --> 00:31:48.575
It's like my- Just looping all day.

00:31:48.575 --> 00:31:48.944
Yeah.

00:31:48.944 --> 00:31:52.925
Like, I'll meet like tweens that are like, we'll watch it before bed and stuff.

00:31:52.925 --> 00:31:58.738
And then with Zombie Town, it was like one of their most watched movies of October last year.

00:31:58.738 --> 00:32:00.838
So I didn't have to promote those.

00:32:00.838 --> 00:32:01.949
It was just watched, right?

00:32:01.949 --> 00:32:02.929
People can just click in it.

00:32:02.929 --> 00:32:04.849
The power of streaming.

00:32:04.849 --> 00:32:06.029
But with comics.

00:32:06.029 --> 00:32:07.200
It's not like that.

00:32:07.200 --> 00:32:10.180
It's like, trust me, try it, just give it a try.

00:32:10.180 --> 00:32:11.589
It's different.

00:32:12.109 --> 00:32:18.259
And honestly, my passion for it all just comes from me wanting to keep making more, more than anything.

00:32:18.259 --> 00:32:19.609
It's not about money.

00:32:19.609 --> 00:32:23.329
It's honestly, if I wanted money, I would not have gotten into comics.

00:32:23.329 --> 00:32:23.970
Absolutely.

00:32:23.970 --> 00:32:25.559
No one gets into comics for the money.

00:32:25.559 --> 00:32:26.029
promise.

00:32:26.029 --> 00:32:27.099
Yeah, exactly.

00:32:27.099 --> 00:32:30.369
I really want people to read this story.

00:32:30.369 --> 00:32:31.150
Yeah.

00:32:31.150 --> 00:32:32.289
You know, good friend of the show.

00:32:32.289 --> 00:32:36.769
I don't know if you ever met him, Zach Quainton's, he's a comic writer as well, but he also works with the beat.

00:32:36.769 --> 00:32:47.128
He, he once told me, he said this to me and it stuck with me, you know, many, many, I would say many months later, cause it's only been like San Diego, but he said comics demands participation.

00:32:47.128 --> 00:32:48.470
Like the medium demands it.

00:32:48.470 --> 00:32:59.680
If you don't, if you don't put the work in to keep it going, whether that be as a journalist or a writer or an artist or a fan or an editor or whatever, like the medium.

00:32:59.680 --> 00:33:02.771
is only as strong as the people that are involved with it.

00:33:02.771 --> 00:33:14.259
So, you know, people like you and I and people listening to this right now who love comics, you have to you have to support the things that you love and you have to like champion these things that you're a big fan of.

00:33:14.259 --> 00:33:16.771
And you and that also comes from the creator side as well.

00:33:16.771 --> 00:33:24.917
If you really, really care about a property that you're writing, you have to promote it because to be honest, and this is no shade towards Clover or any other any other publisher.

00:33:24.917 --> 00:33:28.329
I mean, I guess it kind of is a little bit of shit because I don't work for any of them.

00:33:28.329 --> 00:33:31.465
But The publishers do a terrible job at promoting comics.

00:33:31.465 --> 00:33:35.346
I'll be 100 % on it, especially, and I'm speaking big time of the big two.

00:33:35.346 --> 00:33:40.465
Marvel, DC do not promote their own comics, but like I would say publishers across the board.

00:33:40.465 --> 00:33:45.435
And you may even have a different experience when it comes to Clover because like you said, they don't often do single issues.

00:33:45.435 --> 00:33:47.046
They mostly do the art books and such.

00:33:47.046 --> 00:33:47.885
Yeah, they do.

00:33:47.885 --> 00:33:49.705
The graphic novels too is a big thing.

00:33:49.705 --> 00:33:52.046
They've done a few single issues, but, I get it.

00:33:52.046 --> 00:34:01.005
And I understand why even DC and Marvel don't necessarily promote their books well is The margins are razor thin, right?

00:34:01.005 --> 00:34:03.836
And this is a business still.

00:34:07.213 --> 00:34:09.679
The goal is to break even.

00:34:09.860 --> 00:34:12.331
And that's on the printing, to break even on the printing.

00:34:12.331 --> 00:34:17.164
Don't forget all the costs that are involved with artists and stuff.

00:34:17.403 --> 00:34:20.206
So it is, I understand it.

00:34:20.206 --> 00:34:23.626
I get where they're coming from and why.

00:34:23.626 --> 00:34:27.369
Clover was really great in getting the word out early.

00:34:28.942 --> 00:34:36.282
They involve a publicist that really, really got the word out about Armored's first Kickstarter.

00:34:36.661 --> 00:34:38.581
And I kind of love that about them.

00:34:38.581 --> 00:34:47.112
They were like, they full out went crazy with, I think I did 13 interviews when the Kickstarter dropped.

00:34:47.112 --> 00:34:49.041
Like I was doing it with- But you were on media blitz.

00:34:49.041 --> 00:34:50.641
Yeah, it was crazy.

00:34:50.641 --> 00:34:53.242
And I was like, I'm like, nobody, I'm doing all these interviews.

00:34:53.262 --> 00:34:57.501
to have their support was just incredible.

00:34:57.501 --> 00:34:58.411
But yeah.

00:34:58.411 --> 00:35:02.884
you do have to do a lot because even after that you have to keep counting the pavement.

00:35:02.884 --> 00:35:04.295
It's like, yeah, sure.

00:35:04.295 --> 00:35:10.927
CBR and AIPT interviewed me, but that doesn't equal sales or doesn't equal readers.

00:35:10.927 --> 00:35:13.088
yeah.

00:35:13.088 --> 00:35:16.860
Well, next time you talk to Kalevar, tell them I'm excited to get my Mac all read art book.

00:35:16.860 --> 00:35:17.880
I'm excited for that.

00:35:17.880 --> 00:35:18.371
my God.

00:35:18.371 --> 00:35:18.581
Yeah.

00:35:18.581 --> 00:35:20.590
Their art books are so nice.

00:35:20.831 --> 00:35:24.972
I've got the Mac and the Lev ones right now and I'm like, I need the others.

00:35:26.373 --> 00:35:35.722
You know, you mentioned this earlier and I wanted to make this comparison and this isn't me fishing for a pull quote, but the way that I will like sort of pitch armored going forward.

00:35:35.722 --> 00:35:39.746
And you mentioned this movie earlier when you said I almost said something, but I didn't want to stop you because you were on a run.

00:35:39.746 --> 00:35:44.150
But this series so far, again, I've only read the first five issues.

00:35:44.150 --> 00:35:46.512
It kind of feels like a mixture of poltergeist meets.

00:35:46.512 --> 00:35:52.461
And tell me if you've seen this movie, the Disney Channel original movie from 1997 called Underwraps.

00:35:52.461 --> 00:35:53.181
Have you seen that one?

00:35:53.181 --> 00:35:53.612
Okay.

00:35:53.612 --> 00:35:54.202
Here's what's funny.

00:35:54.202 --> 00:35:56.092
I think I've watched with my kids.

00:35:56.092 --> 00:35:59.041
Did they like do a remake of it or something?

00:35:59.121 --> 00:35:59.762
that's a good question.

00:35:59.762 --> 00:36:03.731
I'll look at, I'll look and see if they have because yeah, it's possible.

00:36:03.731 --> 00:36:05.702
I have watched it with my kids.

00:36:05.702 --> 00:36:07.532
There is a 2021 version.

00:36:07.532 --> 00:36:08.521
I did not know that.

00:36:08.521 --> 00:36:09.001
Wow.

00:36:09.001 --> 00:36:09.342
Okay.

00:36:09.342 --> 00:36:10.121
Yeah.

00:36:10.121 --> 00:36:12.442
haven't watched the original.

00:36:12.572 --> 00:36:14.952
97 one was, was like on repeat when I was a kid.

00:36:14.952 --> 00:36:20.561
The thing I love most about Hugh is, is when people tell me, it reminds me of this.

00:36:20.561 --> 00:36:21.695
It reminds me of that.

00:36:21.695 --> 00:36:25.929
Like there's a lot of people that are like, feels like an 80s movie.

00:36:25.929 --> 00:36:27.099
I'll get people saying that.

00:36:27.099 --> 00:36:33.456
Like this feels like, like I think I was mentioning, I did an interview with AIPT comics.

00:36:33.456 --> 00:36:35.385
They compared it to Flight of the Navigator.

00:36:35.385 --> 00:36:38.099
I don't know if you're old enough to even know what that movie is.

00:36:38.099 --> 00:36:40.141
So you do, yeah.

00:36:40.141 --> 00:36:43.793
So what, yeah, people.

00:36:43.793 --> 00:36:46.536
I'm getting a little monster squad in there as well.

00:36:46.681 --> 00:36:47.833
Totally, totally.

00:36:47.833 --> 00:36:52.666
And know, Brad from Comic Book Couples Counseling always says, it reminds him of House Two.

00:36:52.666 --> 00:36:55.327
I don't know if you ever saw House Two, there's Gramps.

00:36:57.168 --> 00:37:06.164
all these things, you know, when you're writing, it's subconsciously just in the back of your head and you don't realize you're borrowing from it.

00:37:06.164 --> 00:37:08.617
Like some things are conscious.

00:37:08.617 --> 00:37:14.340
Like there's like a line I steal from American Werewolf in London where I'm just like, you know, the kid calls him a meatloaf.

00:37:14.340 --> 00:37:15.853
That was just Meatloaf Jack.

00:37:15.853 --> 00:37:17.733
from American Worlds in London.

00:37:19.293 --> 00:37:24.204
Yeah, you know, I think I do it in a lot of my movies, like, as well.

00:37:24.204 --> 00:37:28.213
Like when we worked on Gnome Alone, the director and I are huge fans of House.

00:37:28.393 --> 00:37:39.603
And he was, we both like laughed and were like, what if we just ripped off a scene from House where he goes into the, the cabinet in the bathroom into another world.

00:37:39.603 --> 00:37:41.134
And so that's what we did in Gnome Alone.

00:37:41.134 --> 00:37:42.782
We were like, we just.

00:37:42.782 --> 00:37:44.813
It's like paying homage to all these things.

00:37:44.813 --> 00:37:54.184
then with Armored, I think it was like subconsciously paying homage to them, not realizing that I'm kind of borrowing all my, things that influenced me and putting it in here.

00:37:54.184 --> 00:37:55.927
Like there's Evil Dead stuff in here.

00:37:55.927 --> 00:38:00.340
There's, you name it, but I do love the comparisons.

00:38:00.340 --> 00:38:01.005
had one.

00:38:01.005 --> 00:38:03.706
comic books, comics, what is it?

00:38:03.706 --> 00:38:05.835
Comics and chronic or chronic and comics.

00:38:05.835 --> 00:38:06.846
don't know if you know that.

00:38:06.846 --> 00:38:12.126
He was like, it reminds me of a movie called star kid, which I'd never seen before.

00:38:12.126 --> 00:38:13.036
the star kid with Jeff Bridges.

00:38:13.036 --> 00:38:13.425
course.

00:38:13.425 --> 00:38:13.635
Yeah.

00:38:13.635 --> 00:38:15.846
And he, I, yeah.

00:38:15.846 --> 00:38:17.706
And I was like, okay, that's cool.

00:38:17.706 --> 00:38:19.405
Like I love the comparisons.

00:38:19.405 --> 00:38:19.766
Yeah.

00:38:19.766 --> 00:38:20.556
I love it.

00:38:20.556 --> 00:38:21.556
Fly the Navigator is interesting.

00:38:21.556 --> 00:38:26.126
I, I have, I wasn't thinking of that one, but since you said it, that makes sense.

00:38:26.126 --> 00:38:27.786
God, I wish I was in that trailer park that night.

00:38:27.786 --> 00:38:29.474
I would, I would have loved to go out there and fight.

00:38:29.474 --> 00:38:30.733
Fight the good fight too.

00:38:30.733 --> 00:38:37.914
Yeah, well, I will say this, you know, we've been working on the second arc, right, which would be issues six to 10.

00:38:37.916 --> 00:38:42.838
And you're going to see influences from something wicked this way comes.

00:38:43.157 --> 00:38:46.568
You're going to see some Watcher in the Woods influences.

00:38:46.568 --> 00:38:49.260
Yeah, you'll it's not stopping.

00:38:50.034 --> 00:38:55.641
Are you familiar with the with the I think it's a literary theory called New Historicism.

00:38:55.641 --> 00:38:56.907
You ever heard of that before?

00:38:56.907 --> 00:38:59.159
No, I've never heard that term before.

00:38:59.159 --> 00:39:00.070
I'm going to get real heady.

00:39:00.070 --> 00:39:06.864
I promise everyone listening right now, I am not as smart as I'm about to sound here in a second, but I did study a little literary theory in college.

00:39:06.864 --> 00:39:17.989
And one of them, new historicism essentially is exactly what we're talking about, which is that like when we're writing something, whether we know it or not, we are putting parts of our subconscious into our work.

00:39:17.989 --> 00:39:23.353
Things that we love, things that we hate, things that we are purposely trying to avoid, and then things that we're borrowing from.

00:39:23.353 --> 00:39:24.432
And I have a good example of this.

00:39:24.432 --> 00:39:30.644
When I was in college again, we were told to write an original story about a character that already exists.

00:39:30.644 --> 00:39:36.369
And being a comic fan that I am, I wrote a Punisher story that I'm still really proud of to this day.

00:39:36.369 --> 00:39:42.744
And when my friend, I gave it to a friend that I, the comic shop that I used to frequent back in St.

00:39:42.744 --> 00:39:50.159
Louis and he read it and he goes, it's awesome, but it's really familiar to Garth Ennis' run from the 90s, the Punisher Max stuff.

00:39:50.239 --> 00:39:54.253
And that's hilarious because I've never read Punisher Max, but.

00:39:54.253 --> 00:40:08.954
every Punisher story I've read since Punisher Max has been created, creators, comic creators have borrowed from Punisher Max elements of Frank's journey and Garth and Steve Dillon's run on that comic.

00:40:09.054 --> 00:40:11.893
They've borrowed bits and pieces of that and put it in their own work that I have read.

00:40:11.893 --> 00:40:17.034
So therefore I am like borrowing sort of like secondhand ideas from that run.

00:40:17.034 --> 00:40:19.134
So it's just interesting how we do that.

00:40:19.134 --> 00:40:20.954
And I think a lot of writers do that, right?

00:40:20.954 --> 00:40:21.728
Like look at...

00:40:21.728 --> 00:40:24.818
Even Quentin Tarantino, his whole career is based on that.

00:40:26.880 --> 00:40:30.360
It is interesting because one of the questions I get asked a lot is where did you come up with the idea?

00:40:30.360 --> 00:40:49.226
And I can't, it's just an idea that popped in there one day, but I know at the time I was watching a lot of an 80s cartoon called Visionaries, which it's like set in some future where they all have these weird kind of night costumes, but they have this, the toys had these holograms on their chest and.

00:40:49.677 --> 00:40:51.108
They always look like ghosts to me.

00:40:51.108 --> 00:40:57.784
There was also a toy line called Super Naturals where there was like ghosts with holograms.

00:40:59.166 --> 00:41:02.099
And I know that that was probably an influence.

00:41:02.099 --> 00:41:09.414
Like I really can see a direct correlation because like my son was just a baby and I was, I don't know why revisiting that cartoon.

00:41:09.554 --> 00:41:12.588
And I used to travel to Germany a lot as a kid.

00:41:12.588 --> 00:41:15.699
So just wandering around castles.

00:41:15.699 --> 00:41:21.396
So I'm sure even that like things from my childhood are popping up in this thing.

00:41:21.797 --> 00:41:25.030
Those who control the magic control destiny.

00:41:25.030 --> 00:41:26.101
Yes.

00:41:27.722 --> 00:41:31.106
I remember seeing this like very sparingly.

00:41:31.106 --> 00:41:35.768
Like it's not, it's not a core memory for me, but I do remember visionaries from back in the day.

00:41:36.070 --> 00:41:36.590
okay.

00:41:36.590 --> 00:41:39.333
So there's one other tidbit that I want to touch on about armored.

00:41:39.333 --> 00:41:44.838
You, sort of leaked some, some private details before the recording and I want to ask you about it here live on the show.

00:41:44.838 --> 00:41:48.277
So Tell me a little bit about this half issue that you're doing for Armored.

00:41:48.277 --> 00:41:58.038
Okay, so I am also a co-host, a more recent addition to this podcast called Wizards, the podcast guide to comics.

00:41:58.038 --> 00:42:03.838
So what we do on the podcast is we do a deep dive into each issue of Wizard Magazine.

00:42:03.838 --> 00:42:08.577
They started five years ago and I've replaced a previous co-host.

00:42:09.057 --> 00:42:10.998
And we just look at...

00:42:10.998 --> 00:42:12.518
you know, different issues of wizard.

00:42:12.518 --> 00:42:16.380
But one of the things we talk a lot about are the half issues that they used to do.

00:42:16.617 --> 00:42:19.101
And you know, you can mail away for them.

00:42:19.443 --> 00:42:28.057
And when I joined like a few months in the guy I replaced who's still very much a part of the podcast, but doesn't do the episodes all the time.

00:42:28.057 --> 00:42:37.483
Him and the guy that they created this podcast together, Adam and Michael, they asked, you know, would you be up for doing like a half issue for armored?

00:42:37.483 --> 00:42:40.737
Like we would we would be the publishers of it.

00:42:40.737 --> 00:42:42.826
And I was like, well, let me ask Clover.

00:42:42.826 --> 00:42:44.414
They're like my publisher.

00:42:44.414 --> 00:42:46.327
I have to get permission from them.

00:42:46.608 --> 00:42:49.731
Hank, Clover was like, yes, this sounds awesome.

00:42:49.731 --> 00:42:50.931
Just do it.

00:42:51.393 --> 00:42:57.918
And so this half issue, probably when this episode is dropped, is now live.

00:42:57.978 --> 00:43:03.322
And what it is is it's a 24-page comic with an original Armored story.

00:43:03.503 --> 00:43:05.998
So you don't even have to be an Armored fan to like...

00:43:05.998 --> 00:43:07.228
enjoy this book.

00:43:07.228 --> 00:43:14.237
It's just a short story, but at the same time, the final page gives hints to future stories.

00:43:14.237 --> 00:43:15.257
So it is canon.

00:43:15.257 --> 00:43:16.297
It is canon.

00:43:16.297 --> 00:43:21.597
the stuff on that page is like, it's just a gold mine for people who have read one through five.

00:43:21.597 --> 00:43:23.617
You'll be like, what is that?

00:43:23.617 --> 00:43:24.827
Who is that?

00:43:24.827 --> 00:43:26.498
What does that mean?

00:43:26.498 --> 00:43:28.018
Is it Ishmael still on art?

00:43:28.018 --> 00:43:28.637
It's Ishmael.

00:43:28.637 --> 00:43:30.697
Yeah, we brought back Ishmael.

00:43:30.717 --> 00:43:35.331
We do an homage cover of a classic 90s comic.

00:43:35.425 --> 00:43:38.268
You'll see when it drops.

00:43:38.268 --> 00:43:46.806
It's up now, so people should go check it out, but it is an homage to Spider-Man Unlimited, Maximum Carnage 1.

00:43:47.072 --> 00:43:48.523
So I love it.

00:43:48.523 --> 00:43:49.353
It's so awesome.

00:43:49.353 --> 00:43:51.364
We just had to make everything 90s feeling.

00:43:51.364 --> 00:43:56.557
We brought back one of the artists from Wizard that used to do the cartoons.

00:43:56.557 --> 00:44:01.771
Brian Ahern used to do, I think it was like the calendars for Wizard Magazine.

00:44:01.771 --> 00:44:03.371
So he does a funny...

00:44:03.480 --> 00:44:10.215
comic strip for Armored, guy, Philip Seve, I don't know if you're familiar with him, he's an artist.

00:44:10.896 --> 00:44:19.862
He is doing, there used to be a feature in Wizard Magazine where his last hero's standing and just pitted two heroes or villains against each other.

00:44:19.862 --> 00:44:29.590
So it's Sir William versus a bunch of ghost characters from other companies that I won't mention here.

00:44:29.931 --> 00:44:32.273
Copyright, we'll talk later.

00:44:33.333 --> 00:44:39.717
Real quick, it's funny about Philip Seve is that he actually did a book with Drew Zucker called The House.

00:44:39.717 --> 00:44:43.239
We keep talking about the house, the movie, but I just thought it was a funny connection.

00:44:43.239 --> 00:44:43.539
Funny.

00:44:43.539 --> 00:44:44.130
Yeah, yeah.

00:44:44.130 --> 00:44:44.621
We love Phil.

00:44:44.621 --> 00:44:49.242
Phil has been co-host a few times to fill in for me or he's been with me on some of the episodes.

00:44:49.242 --> 00:44:49.483
Yeah.

00:44:49.483 --> 00:44:49.954
No kidding.

00:44:49.954 --> 00:44:50.418
No kidding.

00:44:50.418 --> 00:44:50.603
Yeah.

00:44:50.603 --> 00:44:55.726
He's a huge Wizards fan, but yeah, the other thing that's really cool is if it's a flip book style.

00:44:55.726 --> 00:45:10.077
So on the other side, we do an homage cover to Wizard Magazine, but Adam also has written an extensive article where he's interviewed the previous owner of Wizard Magazine and old staffers about half issues and the history of them.

00:45:10.077 --> 00:45:15.038
And we're also including a comprehensive guide to collect all the half issues.

00:45:15.038 --> 00:45:19.677
like this thing is packed with stuff and it's going to it's limited to 500 copies.

00:45:19.677 --> 00:45:25.367
So this is like the ultimate collector's edition will not be in stores unless some store buys a bunch of copies.

00:45:25.367 --> 00:45:28.398
But it's not going to be like sort of diamond or lunar or anything.

00:45:28.398 --> 00:45:28.958
Yeah.

00:45:28.958 --> 00:45:29.538
Sure.

00:45:29.538 --> 00:45:36.601
Well, like, like you were saying earlier, we're going to, I'm to put a link in the show note for both, both this, for the Kickstarter and also for the half issue as well.

00:45:36.601 --> 00:45:37.894
That way everybody has access to that.

00:45:37.894 --> 00:45:44.045
So if you're listening right now and you want to support armored, which I highly recommend that you do, it'll be in the show notes as you're listening to this conversation.

00:45:44.045 --> 00:45:46.266
And Michael, honestly, that is what I have for you today.

00:45:46.266 --> 00:45:49.389
I am just so honored that we finally got you here on the podcast.

00:45:49.389 --> 00:45:51.460
Talk about horror, talk about armored.

00:45:51.530 --> 00:45:55.972
I, I, again, I read the all five issues really like what you're doing here.

00:45:55.972 --> 00:45:58.958
That teaser at the end of issue five.

00:45:58.958 --> 00:46:06.367
Not that I wasn't already going to be following along anyway, but that teaser at the end of issue five, I was like, okay, who, who's got what's happening here?

00:46:06.367 --> 00:46:12.398
I don't want to give too much of what's I don't want to, I don't want to ruin the tease for anybody, but yeah, there's a, there's a spoiler.

00:46:12.398 --> 00:46:16.367
There's a tease that is it'll want you having it'll want it'll have you wanting more.

00:46:16.367 --> 00:46:16.518
Geez.

00:46:16.518 --> 00:46:17.717
I can't talk.

00:46:17.878 --> 00:46:19.338
Well, I'll leave you with this.

00:46:19.338 --> 00:46:26.213
I will say for anyone that's read one through five, this character, she was in issue one.

00:46:26.318 --> 00:46:28.108
Okay, she okay.

00:46:28.108 --> 00:46:28.577
There you go.

00:46:28.577 --> 00:46:35.157
You know, I will like I said like most of the people that read armored are Adults right now.

00:46:35.157 --> 00:46:53.751
There's the odd parent that'll buy armored for their kid when they find out I'm the writer of no Malone but You know Mike I have had kids read it now and my daughter for instance really liked the series and I after she read five she was like Who is this new character?

00:46:53.751 --> 00:46:55.391
And I was like, you got to go back to issue one.

00:46:55.391 --> 00:46:56.402
She couldn't figure it out.

00:46:56.402 --> 00:46:58.621
So I want to know if you can figure it out, Chris.

00:46:58.621 --> 00:46:59.652
OK, all right.

00:46:59.652 --> 00:47:00.552
We'll talk off the air.

00:47:00.552 --> 00:47:03.192
don't want to I don't want to try to guess here live on the show.

00:47:03.192 --> 00:47:06.561
But Michael, again, it's been such a pleasure.

00:47:06.581 --> 00:47:12.422
I'd love to have you back on at some point, maybe after the second arc, perhaps we can have you back on and talk more.

00:47:12.422 --> 00:47:14.606
Can I leave you with one other little thing?

00:47:14.606 --> 00:47:15.545
Please, please.

00:47:15.545 --> 00:47:18.255
I have been working with my My wife is a writer.

00:47:18.255 --> 00:47:19.556
She's a television writer as well.

00:47:19.556 --> 00:47:24.925
We have written an original graphic novel or it could end up being a series.

00:47:25.085 --> 00:47:30.385
We have about 80 to 90 pages complete and in the can right now.

00:47:30.385 --> 00:47:33.175
So maybe we can come back and talk to you about that.

00:47:33.175 --> 00:47:35.045
Can we have the wife on as well?

00:47:35.045 --> 00:47:35.536
of course.

00:47:35.536 --> 00:47:36.065
Of course.

00:47:36.065 --> 00:47:36.556
Perfect.

00:47:36.556 --> 00:47:36.766
Yeah.

00:47:36.766 --> 00:47:37.286
I would love that.

00:47:37.286 --> 00:47:38.146
That'd be incredible.

00:47:38.146 --> 00:47:40.985
We're really excited about this.

00:47:41.025 --> 00:47:44.929
This is a a just a story we've wanted to tell forever.

00:47:44.929 --> 00:47:47.478
And we just didn't know what medium it suit best.

00:47:47.478 --> 00:47:51.478
To be completely honest, we were like, you know, it's too big for a movie.

00:47:51.478 --> 00:47:52.440
Like we just didn't know.

00:47:52.440 --> 00:47:56.561
And then after I did Armored, I was like, let's make it a graphic novel.

00:47:56.561 --> 00:47:59.862
This is this is just a story that we have to tell together.

00:48:00.163 --> 00:48:06.005
Comics is usually the best option for for a medium to tell any story.

00:48:06.005 --> 00:48:06.864
You know, totally.

00:48:06.864 --> 00:48:07.175
Yeah.

00:48:07.175 --> 00:48:14.358
And there's so much just, you know, There's, similarities to armored in that there's some ghosts and stuff in it.

00:48:14.358 --> 00:48:14.557
Yeah.

00:48:14.557 --> 00:48:14.838
Yeah.

00:48:14.838 --> 00:48:15.126
Okay.

00:48:15.126 --> 00:48:16.070
All right.

00:48:16.070 --> 00:48:19.652
Well, before we leave you here, Michael, is there anything that you want to shout out?

00:48:19.652 --> 00:48:20.563
How do people follow you?

00:48:20.563 --> 00:48:30.820
All the things they can follow me on Instagram at Mike Schwartz rights or X at the Mike Schwartz or blue sky at the Mike Schwartz.

00:48:30.820 --> 00:48:32.099
I hope that I got that right.

00:48:32.099 --> 00:48:34.001
I can't keep track anymore of all these.

00:48:34.001 --> 00:48:34.422
Yeah.

00:48:34.422 --> 00:48:37.054
I'm sure I have, you know, I'm at Tik TOK at something.

00:48:37.054 --> 00:48:38.103
Who knows?

00:48:39.545 --> 00:48:46.088
But yeah, like just follow me on social media if you're listening to this and hearing about Armored for the first time, reach out to me, send me a DM.

00:48:46.088 --> 00:48:51.789
I respond to every DM and I'll happily send you issue one.

00:48:51.789 --> 00:48:58.811
The fact that you took the time to listen and then like reach out to me, yeah, come get issue one, see if you're into it.

00:48:58.811 --> 00:49:07.534
And I know, know, the stock is low, will say, all the issue four is probably sold out by now to be completely honest, but.

00:49:07.947 --> 00:49:09.878
You may still be able to find copies of issue one.

00:49:09.878 --> 00:49:10.958
Just go to read it.

00:49:10.958 --> 00:49:11.798
Somehow read it.

00:49:11.798 --> 00:49:12.798
Find it.

00:49:14.059 --> 00:49:19.942
You know, when we were talking about this initially at New York at the Harvey Awards, I was like, can we please talk spoilers?

00:49:19.942 --> 00:49:29.543
And now that we as soon as we got on camera, I wanted to back off from that idea because I want people to go out and read it themselves first.

00:49:29.543 --> 00:49:35.541
And I think once like the masses have figured out that armored is a good deal, then maybe we can come back.

00:49:35.541 --> 00:49:52.614
Once you've finished maybe a couple volumes, maybe two, three volumes, maybe we can come back and talk full spoilers, but it feels slightly bad to do a spoiler free conversation or a spoilery conversation when issue five had maybe just come out as this conversation is going live.

00:49:52.614 --> 00:49:55.295
So give people enough time to go out and read that themselves.

00:49:55.295 --> 00:49:56.137
Totally.

00:49:56.137 --> 00:49:57.097
Sounds good to me.

00:49:57.097 --> 00:49:59.869
Well, Michael, thank you so much for joining us here on the Oblivion Bar podcast.

00:49:59.869 --> 00:50:02.302
We will see you the next time you're on the show.

00:50:02.302 --> 00:50:02.820
All right.

00:50:02.820 --> 00:50:04.161
Thanks so much, Chris.