INTERVIEW: James Tynion IV & Christian Ward

Transcript

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Hi there, this is James Tynan IV.

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And this is Christian Ward.

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And we are the creative team behind the haunted distillery series Spectrograph.

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And you are listening to the Oblivion Bar Podcast.

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Welcome to the Oblivion Bar podcast with your host Chris Hacker and Aaron Knowles.

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Hello everyone, welcome to episode 153 of the Oblivion Bar podcast, the official podcast of the Fancy Shop in St.

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Charles, Missouri.

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I am your Lovecraftian Dark Creature of the Night from Gotham Below, Chris Hacker, and joining me this week is the man who owns the absolute nicest house on the lake, my co -host and BFF, Aaron Knowles.

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Just me and my ghost guts hanging out and quote unquote living the good life.

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I got to put the living part in quotations, right?

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Because this is a spoopy episode because this week on the show we have the creative team of the upcoming distillery horror book spectrograph from James Tynan and Christian Ward.

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Now, Aaron, we talked about it a little bit at the end of episode one fifty two, but we're going to reiterate here in case people weren't there for that conversation with Jason Aaron.

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Go back and listen to that if you have not.

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But what I said there was that James for a long time would often do.

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creator interviews on different podcasts and YouTube channels and such.

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But I don't know if people know this or not.

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He might be the busiest person in comic books right now, you know, between the 30 titles that he's writing plus Tiny Onion.

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He just doesn't have time.

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So the fact that he was able to join us this week with our good friend and one of, in my opinion, one of the best creators and one of the nicest folks in the comic industry.

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The nicest human beings on the planet.

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100 % Christian Ward.

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is also here to talk about, again, their upcoming horror book through the story Spectrograph.

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And Aaron, to kind of speak on this just a little bit, you know, we spoke to Scott Snyder a couple of weeks ago and he was on to talk about his story, horror series, White Boat, which you'll hear that conversation here in a couple of weeks.

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But I want to refer to what he had said, which is and you'll actually hear it in this conversation.

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He was talking more about Spectrograph than he was talking about White Boat in that conversation.

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Right.

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I think he's just honestly, I think he's just like like again.

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We said this so many times.

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He's just like a nice fucking dude, but also he's happy for his people.

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Like he's happy for the comic industry.

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He's happy for this good content, this good literature to come out.

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And he's super happy about the stories and distillery in general.

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Yeah, absolutely.

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And of course, you know, we'll talk about it during this conversation, but James was actually a student of Scott's.

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I'm guessing that Scott's center was a professor there for a bit talking about maybe script writing or comics in general.

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But regardless, That was kind of my first exposure to James and his work.

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You know, when he first came out, he of course started writing American vampire, maybe one of the side stories.

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And then he got quickly over into the DC universe, started writing, you know, a lot of the dark night metal stuff.

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He also did justice league dark, which I'm a big fan of Batman, of course.

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And then I think it was right around the time where something was killing something is killing the children.

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And Batman is where overnight it felt like James Tynan stock just ballooned and.

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crashed through the top of the chart, like truly took off.

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And now he's a two time Eisner winner for best writer.

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And I know we've been talking a lot about James here, Christian, again, as we said a moment ago, the nicest person in the world, he is killing it with spectrograph.

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Number one, we had a chance to read that first issue and it is incredible.

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It is typical Christian ward greatness.

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Very excited for people to eventually get to read spectrograph.

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It comes out here, comes out April 24th.

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So I think it comes out.

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The week that we put out this conversation, you will be able to go to your local comic book shop and buy spectrograph number one.

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What really truly Aaron, what bums me out about this conversation, of course, is the great conversation.

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But the one part of it that bums me out is that we didn't get to talk a ton about city of madness as much as I wanted to.

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I had a pretty in -depth question there at the end of the conversation.

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But we, and we said it during our last episode, fastest 45 minutes of all time, like in the history of the oblivion bar, right?

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Yeah, it went by.

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Oh, quicker than you could even imagine.

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Like we're just talking all of a sudden.

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It's like we're like you just you have to start like glancing at the clock even though you don't want to.

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But again, it's the it's it's part of business, you know.

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Oh, yeah.

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You know, James has got places to be.

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And we knew that going in.

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That's why we kept to a tight 45.

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Also, Christian being in the UK, he's got places to be.

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He's got to take care of his kids and his family and get back to work.

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Absolutely.

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And it was 10 p .m.

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when we started the conversation in the UK.

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So he was later than we are.

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It was like 4 p .m.

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for us.

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Over here on like the East and Eastern time over at his time, it was like basically nighttime.

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And then he even stayed after the conversation and talked to us for a bit, which is insane.

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I will say just briefly before we get into the supplemental stuff, before we get in the conversation, one of the best things to come out of this show, undoubtedly is the friendship that we have.

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We have obtained from Christian, like the fact that not only have we had him on the show now four times, so he has supplanted Tom King as the most visited guest on the oblivion bar, but.

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For some reason, short tie.

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Exactly.

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Just two, just two of the best creators in comics going back and forth on who's going to join us the most.

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But for some reason, Christian just keeps wanting to hang out with us and listen, Aaron and I, we are, we, it is not beyond us that that is an incredible deal.

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We love it.

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We love hanging out with him.

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We love having him on the show and we're going to keep riding this train for as long as he wants to keep talking to us.

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So.

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It's a good deal.

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My sweet British boy.

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That's right.

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And before we get in this conversation, why don't you tell the folks how they can support the Oblivion Bar podcast?

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Money, please.

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No, money, daddy, money, money, please.

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No, that sounds so fucking terrible.

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You can help get it.

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They understand at this point.

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Yeah, we're right now.

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No, no self deprecating.

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No self deprecating, okay?

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You can help support the show by visiting us at patreon .com forward slash oblivion bar pod.

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And I'm joking.

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None of the money comes out.

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It all goes back into the show.

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Whenever you see anything getting better in this show, whether it's graphics, music, art, equipment, you guys are helping us make the show better.

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And that's all you, that's all we, we can only thank you for that.

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Obviously we put our time, sweat, money, blood, tears, you know, stool samples, all that stuff into the show.

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Other liquids.

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Yes.

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But we have you to thank for supporting what we do.

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And for your support, you get access to our weekly grid episode, which is kind of our our free form, free flowing, you know, just just off the cuff episode each week that's Patreon exclusive.

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You get access to episode transcripts before the shows come out.

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So you can see what we're going to be talking about.

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Our links, our clicks, all that stuff.

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Early access to normal episodes, a special shout out at the end of each Oblivion Bar episode as well.

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Depending on the tier, you get additional free stuff.

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We love giving out free stuff.

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It's just honestly the best way to support the show, not us, the show.

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So make sure you guys go check out patreon.com forward slash Oblivion Bar Pod.

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We just recently redid all the different tiers and you know, we make it more accessible to everybody.

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So go over again, once again, patreon .com forward slash.

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Oblivion bar pot and check those out.

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Absolutely.

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One more piece of news here.

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We have a panel, Aaron, at the end of this month.

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We have a panel at C2E2.

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What?

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What are you saying?

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Why are you saying what's weird?

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What way?

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On Friday, April 26 at 1115, we are going to be joining the first issue club and the short box podcast at C2E2 for a epic crossover live recording.

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We call it a panel, but truthfully, it's just a recording of an episode that we're going to face.

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Greg, we're looking at you.

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He's tall, though.

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So you have to you're going to kick it.

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You have to get like Van Damme.

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You got a high kick.

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The guy will like flip upside down.

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I'll give you a boost.

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You'll run at me.

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I'll throw you in the air.

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What's it called the move where where like Colossus like or Hulk throws?

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No, it's Colossus throws war.

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Yeah, the fastball.

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Yeah, yeah, yeah.

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Yeah.

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Join us in room S four oh five dash B to hear a live recording of our three shows getting together and talking about comics, talking about podcasting, talking about spinning high kicks, all the things about me will have C2E2 exclusive stickers, shirts, posters.

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As Aaron said, we like to give out free stuff.

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We'll be doing it at our panel.

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They they've all been curated and made by our good friend and fellow patron of the show, Elliot Dixon.

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It's a homage to Wolverine number eight from 1989 by Chris Claremont and John Breschema.

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So it's incredible.

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I mean, we've posted all over our social media.

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So give that a look.

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It's going to be incredible.

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And also we'll have, as Aaron, you said this in our last episode and thank you for reminding me, we're actually going to have a panel exclusive holographic sticker.

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So you can, there's only going to be 10 of them in existence.

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And if you come to that panel, you have the chance to get one of them.

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So visit the link in our show notes for more details on that.

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Very excited to hang out with Bader from the short box, Andy and Greg from the first issue club.

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And of course, us two knuckleheads hanging out with everybody just talking, talking, podcasting a couple of knuckleheads.

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So without further ado, we've been rambling long enough.

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Let's get into our conversation with James Tynan, the fourth and Christian Ward.

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Hey, Aaron, how do you like to read your comic books digitally?

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Chris, it's funny that you should say that.

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I just started buying and reading my comics on Omnibus.

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Oh, interesting.

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I actually heard from a little birdie.

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It's actually backed by some of the top publishers in the medium.

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It also hosts an extensive back catalog from Image Comics, Boom Studios, Dark Horse, Ahoy Comics, Titan, Vault, and many more.

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And most importantly, Omnibus supports in-app purchases.

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That little birdie is called X now, but also Omnibus has officially been made reading and buying comics digitally the easiest it's ever been.

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Wow, that's incredible.

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And you know what I'm going to do, Aaron?

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I'm actually going to go right now to my iPad iOS device and download Omnibus.

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And also right after that, I'm going to go follow them over on social media.

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at the Omnibus app.

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Omnibus for fans by fans.

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This week's special guest.

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Joining us this week on the show is the creative team behind the highly anticipated prestige formatted for issue haunted ghost story at distillery publishing spectrograph.

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One is an Eisner award winning and New York times bestselling author of titles like something is killing the children, nice house on the lake, blue book, department of truth, house of slaughter, world tree and the deviant.

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They also recently just started a production company, tiny onion, which plans to develop a number of those successful series we just listed and adapt them for both.

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television and film.

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The other is the three time Eisner winning comic book creator behind titles like Aquaman Andromeda, Odyssey, Invisible Kingdom, Black Bolt, Bloodstained Teeth and Batman City of Madness.

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This is also his fourth time on the show making him the most visited guest of all time.

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It is our honor to welcome both James Tynden the fourth and Christian Ward onto the Oblivion Bar podcast.

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Yeah.

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Fuck you, Tom King.

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Fuck you, Tom King.

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Chris, what did I say?

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Chris, what did I say?

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I said that was coming out of your mouth.

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We started a turn for Tom King.

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This is an ambush.

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I didn't know he was going to say that.

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I promise.

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So, James, just so you kind of know what's going on here, we had Tom King on the show only a couple of weeks ago, and we told him that Christian has been on the show more times than him.

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And he started to, I mean, Christian.

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truthfully, he was badmouthing you, right?

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Like he was coming at you.

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Yeah.

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I'm like, we're mortal enemies now.

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Like, I mean, I'm glad he's not got any military training because you know, I don't have to worry.

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I'm bringing those inflatable like boxing gloves.

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I don't know if you have them like these soccer boppers.

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I'm bringing them to NYCC.

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So when you come, you guys can just.

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settle it out.

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Yeah, absolutely.

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I can bring my real boxing gloves.

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No, no, no.

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This is getting dangerously close to me getting bruised.

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This is like ego or physically.

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Yeah, I'm like a peach.

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You don't touch this.

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Well, thank you both so much for being here.

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Let's go ahead and start off by talking about the series that you are both currently working on over at Distillery, as we just said, Spectrograph.

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The first issue comes out on April 24th.

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And this four issue series has been described as an exotic and terrifying take on the occult and the paranormal.

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Now I have a little clip here.

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I actually have a couple of clips planned throughout this conversation.

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So here's our first one.

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Christian, this might sound familiar to you.

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Me and James have been circling each other for years.

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We've been, you know, I'm such a huge fan of his and you know, I'd like to think he feels the same way.

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Inverse and we first talked about spectrograph.

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I think it was two years ago.

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This is an idea that he kind of came up with.

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He sent me the story, the actual the beats of what will happen.

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And I was like, oh, that's so fucking cool.

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I was just like, I want to read that.

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And the thing that I loved when he sent it to me was I was like, I'm going to be the first person that's going to read it.

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How cool is that?

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Like, I'll have read it before anyone else.

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And I can't wait.

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So James, yeah, let's, let's go ahead and start with that.

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Let's talk about that a little bit.

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So as you just heard, it sounds like you and Christian have been trying to work together on a series for a while now.

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So what was it about?

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Not only this story, but distillery that brought you two together finally.

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So, I mean, we had started talking about this kind of in, uh, you know, without out really talking about what publisher it would land at.

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This would have been in the lead up to the first time we collaborated together on.

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a Swamp Thing short story.

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And so it's like, which I think would have been like the Halloween right after the launch of, I think it would have come out fall like October, 2020.

00:14:31.710 --> 00:14:33.159
Like that seems about right.

00:14:33.159 --> 00:14:39.210
So we would have started talking after something is killing the children and like around the launch of Department of Truth.

00:14:39.210 --> 00:14:41.549
And then it was just sort of like us.

00:14:41.549 --> 00:14:45.830
Uh, you know, basically saying we both really, really like each other's work.

00:14:45.830 --> 00:14:47.929
We would love to find something down the road.

00:14:47.929 --> 00:14:50.330
We both had a very full dance card.

00:14:50.330 --> 00:14:54.330
Uh, but there was, you know, there were sort of two things that were in the back of my mind.

00:14:54.330 --> 00:15:01.720
One, like the first of which was like, you know, Hey, like let's work on this one thing thing that that was great.

00:15:01.720 --> 00:15:04.461
And then, you know, I was about to take over.

00:15:04.461 --> 00:15:08.961
the main, the pilot seat of the Batmobile over in the Gotham line.

00:15:08.961 --> 00:15:15.922
And it was like, let's find like an issue that we can do somewhere in here to play around in Gotham city.

00:15:15.942 --> 00:15:19.841
And then from there, it's just like, then we'll start working on Spectograph.

00:15:19.841 --> 00:15:25.518
But really in that, those first sort of conversations, you know, I had started laying out.

00:15:25.518 --> 00:15:34.957
You know, with Department of Truth, I had kind of realized that I loved working from things that I could do some research on and tap into my deep...

00:15:34.957 --> 00:15:53.477
like interests and, uh, you know, all sorts of weirdness and, you know, the one area like department of truth sometimes touches into the occult, but it doesn't really go super far into that, you know, and what it really doesn't go into is like the entire history of like spiritualism and everything, uh, like that in American history.

00:15:53.477 --> 00:16:02.658
And that's like a whole leg of, you know, a strange history of the United States is like all exists on that kind of, on that wavelength.

00:16:02.658 --> 00:16:04.912
And so that was something I really wanted to tap into.

00:16:04.912 --> 00:16:39.446
But it was just it all came down to a simple pitch and I don't mind spoiling it because it's the first few pages of the first issue Which is basically you have the this man who has been a key member of this occult organization who spent the first half of his life spending his tremendous fortune trying to prove that ghosts exist and then he comes to a like firm decision they don't Like, he has proved that they don't exist, that everything they've been talking about in this occult group is wrong, and then he spends the second half of his life using the rest of his fortune to make ghosts exist.

00:16:39.446 --> 00:16:44.716
And that is the kind of, like, central concept of spectrograph.

00:16:44.716 --> 00:16:53.645
And spectrograph refers to the machine that he spent the rest of his life building, which is embedded into this big, beautiful mansion.

00:16:53.645 --> 00:16:55.926
Christian, what's your viewpoint from this?

00:16:55.926 --> 00:17:01.025
When James came to you for this story, what was your initial reaction?

00:17:01.025 --> 00:17:04.806
Well, I kind of said it in that little clip you played.

00:17:04.826 --> 00:17:12.256
I mean, what James has just said to us right now, that's literally word for word, his selling of his pitch to me.

00:17:12.256 --> 00:17:13.615
And it was just immediate.

00:17:13.615 --> 00:17:15.685
It was just such a cool idea.

00:17:15.685 --> 00:17:21.837
I mean, I think the other thing that James said was that he really wanted to see what my ghost looked like.

00:17:21.837 --> 00:17:26.417
You know, and that was the thing for me, it was just like, what do my ghosts look like?

00:17:26.417 --> 00:17:29.228
You know, what would that kind of, that's something I'd never really done.

00:17:29.228 --> 00:17:38.897
I've never really done kind of like a supernatural, although this is a very kind of left field take on supernatural kind of like horror, but I've never done it.

00:17:38.897 --> 00:17:50.382
So it was, it was really kind of, that was playing to my kind of wheelhouse of like, you know, very kind of nebulous kind of art and kind of like something that's kind of not that as tangible.

00:17:50.382 --> 00:17:54.001
as like, as a traditional pen and ink art might be.

00:17:54.521 --> 00:18:04.821
So yeah, it was just excitement, but like, and then it was just, we would check in with each other literally every year and just be like, you know, how's it, sometimes James would check in with me.

00:18:04.821 --> 00:18:07.021
And then sometimes I'd check in with him.

00:18:07.021 --> 00:18:11.001
It was just, and it was finding that kind of space.

00:18:11.001 --> 00:18:36.102
And it was when Distillery kind of set up that kind of allowed us that opportunity that we were like, that we just, just decided to grab it because they just allowed just such a broader canvas than a lot of other kind of, you know, create our own publishers, lots of amazing creative publishers that we've both worked for, you know, in, you know, the industry that do great books.

00:18:36.102 --> 00:18:45.582
But it was such a specific kind of vision of Distillery, this idea of like, you know, a coffee table art book, you know, really big, oversized.

00:18:45.582 --> 00:18:48.365
I kind of view it as like IMAX comic books.

00:18:48.365 --> 00:18:49.695
You know, they're really, really big.

00:18:49.695 --> 00:18:55.756
And it was, it was just too much of a tantalizing opportunity for us to pass up.

00:18:55.756 --> 00:19:03.675
And we both had like this very small window that we were like, okay, we can, you know, and it was just like, I think we can do that.

00:19:03.675 --> 00:19:04.766
We can aim for that window.

00:19:04.766 --> 00:19:07.945
And we've just gone for it, you know, and it's been really cool.

00:19:07.945 --> 00:19:08.326
Yeah.

00:19:08.326 --> 00:19:17.678
But I mean, like part of it was also like when I finally had, cause it all lined up really, really nicely where it was actually like at a, I was at Thought Bubble.

00:19:17.678 --> 00:19:30.647
And I had the conversation with Chip Mosher and David Steinberger kind of laying out, like, okay, I wanted to understand what were the broad strokes of what we'd be talking about if I were to sign up with them.

00:19:30.647 --> 00:19:41.758
And literally, Christian was there at the show, and so it was just like, I found him right afterwards, and it was just like, they're doing black label -sized creator-owned books.

00:19:41.758 --> 00:19:52.963
And I had just come from an end of a whirlwind tour where I had hit up like, I had gone Italy, Spain, and France, and then the UK.

00:19:52.963 --> 00:20:01.423
And so I had just seen the full breadth of European comics in all of the different size formats, and I'm so deeply, powerfully jealous.

00:20:01.423 --> 00:20:07.150
And I've wanted to work at, like, create our own books at a larger format for a long time.

00:20:07.150 --> 00:20:12.750
When I first started talking about Nice House on the Lake over at DC Black Label, I thought I was gonna get a Black Label sized book.

00:20:12.750 --> 00:20:20.589
And it's like, you know, that was like part of the, oh, hey, like this is gonna be really fun, like playing with a house in that format.

00:20:20.589 --> 00:20:25.349
But then, you know, we talked about it and it ended up in the standard format.

00:20:25.349 --> 00:20:35.880
But it was just like, I really, really wanted to try to like, you know, build, create our own books that are these kind of like, these are the prestige art books.

00:20:35.880 --> 00:20:39.261
These are gonna be like, big, beautiful art artifacts.

00:20:39.261 --> 00:20:45.372
And it's just like, it feels like Europe gets away with that a lot more than we do in our comics market.

00:20:45.372 --> 00:20:51.832
And I am very, very happy to see that there does seem to be some hunger for it.

00:20:51.832 --> 00:20:57.721
And, you know, the fact that these distillery books are actually, like, you know, there's a real excitement around them.

00:20:57.721 --> 00:20:59.422
You know, we know our initial orders.

00:20:59.422 --> 00:21:00.622
They're very strong.

00:21:00.622 --> 00:21:04.402
Like, this is, you know, there are people who want to buy these books.

00:21:04.402 --> 00:21:06.701
And that's really exciting.

00:21:06.701 --> 00:21:29.961
That's what I love about what I've seen, you know, distillery from, from its inception, the announcements to every, every time something is announced, the excitement just purely for not just the stories and the art that's going into it, but it's just, it's, it feels like something I don't want to say like new and shiny because that just gives it kind of like a superficial feel, but this is something that's elevated.

00:21:29.961 --> 00:21:30.211
Yeah.

00:21:30.211 --> 00:21:30.561
Yeah.

00:21:30.561 --> 00:21:31.917
I think that's the right word.

00:21:31.917 --> 00:21:33.097
It feels special.

00:21:33.097 --> 00:21:41.278
And I, and I'm so excited to see, you know, as, again, as a newer person, the comic community to see that kind of inception to fruition is really inspiring.

00:21:41.278 --> 00:21:44.478
And the fact that it's creator owned, you guys are doing something special.

00:21:44.478 --> 00:21:50.798
And then also the fact that you get to kind of highlight those different formats in the, in the IMAX, a comic book kind of idea.

00:21:50.798 --> 00:21:52.278
It's, it's so amazing to see.

00:21:52.278 --> 00:21:56.038
And every single time something is announced, a new story is announced.

00:21:56.038 --> 00:21:59.718
The anticipation is so like, people are excited, palpable.

00:21:59.718 --> 00:22:00.958
It's palpable.

00:22:01.057 --> 00:22:01.422
Absolutely.

00:22:01.422 --> 00:22:13.741
No, and that's more than anything, that's what, you know, that's the biggest reason that I signed on board to do a bunch of books at Distillery because, you know, like I do a bunch of comics at every publisher, it seems like, these days.

00:22:13.741 --> 00:22:27.241
But it is the like right now, like one of the big things for a while, whenever someone like reached out to me, it's like, why, you know, what could I do with this publisher that I couldn't do with one of my publishing partners that I already have?

00:22:27.241 --> 00:22:30.605
And this site, this format is the thing.

00:22:30.605 --> 00:22:40.066
And it's just like the format and the support they're giving to like really do like try something and put them out in like such high quality.

00:22:40.066 --> 00:22:42.576
Like the print quality of these books is incredible.

00:22:42.576 --> 00:22:45.296
Like the, you know, we have spot gloss on the covers.

00:22:45.296 --> 00:22:46.595
Like they're just gorgeous.

00:22:46.595 --> 00:22:48.266
The books are absolutely gorgeous.

00:22:48.266 --> 00:22:51.746
And it's really exciting to be a part of that.

00:22:51.746 --> 00:22:59.246
I'll say Chris is definitely one of the people that I know for a fact saw the worth in it, the beauty in it before I did.

00:22:59.246 --> 00:23:28.653
Because I remember at which convention was it at Chris where I took the book around and I got everybody during the interview I was working Sanio Comic Con is when the devil's cut came out and I had Aaron go around to all of the creators I couldn't get to and have them sign it I got the the gold foil version and I have it in the room actually but but yeah Thank you Aaron for that and you know, it is like you guys have said it's it presents incredibly well It's it's just like this showcase of what?

00:23:28.653 --> 00:23:31.794
the comic medium can be and, you know, in a very different way.

00:23:31.794 --> 00:23:32.233
So, yeah.

00:23:32.233 --> 00:23:33.753
And it reinvigorates something.

00:23:33.753 --> 00:23:36.834
It catches the eye more than just a standard book.

00:23:36.834 --> 00:23:51.114
So, but Christian, you said on the show previously, horror is kind of like this infection that reflects the twists and the certain elements from our modern world and like society in terms of spectrograph and what you and James are creating here.

00:23:51.114 --> 00:23:56.397
What elements of modern culture are you excited to showcase and kind of twist within this story?

00:23:56.397 --> 00:24:01.597
I mean, I'll say a little bit because obviously me and James have kind of spoken of what this is about.

00:24:01.597 --> 00:24:10.157
I mean, obviously, you know, any kind of like ghost stories at its heart kind of about life and death and, you know, kind of the regrets of life and death.

00:24:10.157 --> 00:24:14.617
I mean, ghosts are the kind of the regrets that just sort of linger.

00:24:14.617 --> 00:24:16.998
You know, that's how I kind of perceive ghosts.

00:24:16.998 --> 00:24:21.326
But there's definitely, I mean, I think me and James share a kind of...

00:24:21.326 --> 00:24:31.066
You know, this is kind of like very much a dig at kind of like, you know, kind of like a high society capitalism kind of in a similar way that kind of I looked at with kind of bloodstained teeth.

00:24:31.066 --> 00:24:33.665
So there's there's definitely that element.

00:24:33.665 --> 00:24:48.109
And there's there's, you know, you we're going to meet characters that kind of I would say and James jump in because like I don't want to kind of muddy the waters, but there's definitely kind of like two characters from kind of two different kind of what.

00:24:48.109 --> 00:24:59.269
financial worlds, we've got like, kind of like, you know, the high financial world of the cultists, and then we've got like, kind of like an everyday person that kind of finds themselves in it.

00:24:59.269 --> 00:25:05.690
So there's definitely an idea of kind of high society and muddling by, shall we say.

00:25:06.029 --> 00:25:09.294
But I'll let James kind of expand more because, you know.

00:25:09.294 --> 00:25:10.614
He knows what he's talking about.

00:25:10.614 --> 00:25:12.294
I'm just rambling.

00:25:12.594 --> 00:25:13.282
No, no, no.

00:25:13.282 --> 00:25:15.634
But you're rambling in the right direction.

00:25:15.634 --> 00:25:15.733
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:25:15.733 --> 00:25:41.395
Like, I mean, right at the heart of this whole story is, you know, like I in the lead up to actually writing series itself, you know, I sort of went back and I revisited so many of like the seminal haunted house stories and and and films and just sort of like absorbed all of it and specifically trying to absorb like Like, what are the stories that kind of play against it?

00:25:41.395 --> 00:25:44.786
But it all deals with that kind of the guilt of the past.

00:25:44.786 --> 00:25:48.546
And it's all about a kind of, and it's about a fear of death.

00:25:48.546 --> 00:25:56.385
And at the center of this story is, is meant to be a kind of inversion of that.

00:25:56.385 --> 00:26:00.266
There is a fear of life at the center of this story.

00:26:00.266 --> 00:26:06.637
And that is, that's really what our characters are reaching towards or running away from.

00:26:06.637 --> 00:26:23.367
And it's just like, and what the ghosts represent in conjunction to that is like really one of the central mysteries of the story and the way in which, you know, the way in which haunting works in this is going to, it's going to play in a few different directions.

00:26:23.367 --> 00:26:30.317
And I'm just really, really excited for people to see where we go with it because it's like.

00:26:30.317 --> 00:26:37.337
You know, there were lots of like complicated ideas that we're playing with in here, but the heart of the story is a very human story.

00:26:37.337 --> 00:26:51.228
And it is not a, you know, like, this is not like something that I try to bring to all of my work is I want the characters to read very vibrant and alive and of the moment.

00:26:51.228 --> 00:26:57.458
Like I want them to feel like characters that live and breathe in the world that we all live and breathe in.

00:26:57.458 --> 00:27:01.895
And that's something that's like right at right at the heart of this story.

00:27:01.895 --> 00:27:17.435
Like there are heightened characters all around them, but it's just like, you know, the two women at the center of this story, Janie and Vesper are like very, you know, like they're just very, very human and what they want is very, very human.

00:27:17.435 --> 00:27:20.076
And I think people are going to relate tremendously to them.

00:27:20.076 --> 00:27:23.165
And then we're going to see what haunts them and what they're afraid of.

00:27:23.165 --> 00:27:29.453
Well, you're already nailing it with everything that Janie's got going on, cause Janie's a horrible mom.

00:27:29.453 --> 00:27:48.993
Not even like, I feel like, you know, and this is just my idea of like, you know, a good like horror element of a horror story, which, you know, we're reading here is there's always that, that kind of standard level of anxiety that you get of, you know, you're anxious because of something that element that's there.

00:27:48.993 --> 00:27:51.953
And you just introduced it within the first couple of pages.

00:27:51.953 --> 00:27:58.413
And, you know, I'm just going to say it's a baby, but like, it's just like, you're now stuck at this base level of anxiety.

00:27:58.413 --> 00:28:00.294
because it's always there.

00:28:00.294 --> 00:28:09.223
And I think it's interesting because you're saying that this is a world where this guy has discovered that there are no ghosts, but she's clearly haunted by something.

00:28:09.223 --> 00:28:11.324
And so we're all haunted by it now.

00:28:11.324 --> 00:28:20.663
But the question that I kind of wanted to ask real quick, and I'm gonna interject it here, is just that the house kind of reminds me of 13 ghosts.

00:28:20.663 --> 00:28:32.182
I'm a huge fan of, and I had to ask because I'm curious about, you know, cause, It's an entire mechanism that kind of surrounds this one purpose.

00:28:32.182 --> 00:28:34.082
Was that kind of a piece of inspiration?

00:28:34.082 --> 00:28:44.301
As well as you said, the ghosts in this book that we will see all kind of represent something, which all the ghosts in 13 Ghosts represented, they were all kind of like different sins and different issues.

00:28:44.301 --> 00:28:46.422
Do you have anything to say kind of like to...

00:28:46.422 --> 00:28:49.902
I mean, like first and foremost, like, yes, it is a tremendous influence.

00:28:49.902 --> 00:28:57.253
And on top of it, it's just like the, especially the remake on...

00:28:57.390 --> 00:28:58.950
Like with Matthew Lillard and all of that.

00:28:58.950 --> 00:29:05.730
Like that is, it is just one of the most fun horror movies from the like, you know, turn of the millennium.

00:29:05.730 --> 00:29:10.109
Like it is just a really, really good fun movie.

00:29:10.109 --> 00:29:11.569
It's campy in the right ways.

00:29:11.569 --> 00:29:13.170
It's scary in the right ways.

00:29:13.170 --> 00:29:16.049
Each of the ghosts are like interesting and dynamic.

00:29:16.049 --> 00:29:20.509
Like what we're doing with ghosts is very different than what exists at the heart of that.

00:29:20.509 --> 00:29:26.190
The purpose of the machine is very different, but the idea of like a house ghost machine, like.

00:29:26.190 --> 00:29:31.529
You know, it is something that, like, tapping a little bit into that, to my love of that story.

00:29:31.529 --> 00:29:35.650
But I mean, it's just like, obviously that is an occult machine.

00:29:35.650 --> 00:29:40.539
Like, and it just builds into its own, like, fictional mythology, which is part of what's the fun of it.

00:29:40.539 --> 00:29:43.240
All of the ghosts there were collected outside and all that.

00:29:43.240 --> 00:29:51.039
Like, what the ghosts represent here is very fundamentally different, and how the ghosts manifest is very fundamentally different.

00:29:51.039 --> 00:29:55.529
Like, we, you know, this is where we're going to see...

00:29:55.726 --> 00:30:01.605
you know, these ghosts are somehow like very human and very inhuman.

00:30:01.605 --> 00:30:03.846
Like these are scary.

00:30:03.846 --> 00:30:12.125
Like this is, I think Christian and I are both tapping into some, you know, Clive Barker lanes over here.

00:30:12.125 --> 00:30:23.662
So it's just like, this is like, it all manifests very differently, but I've never been shy of letting, you know, wearing my influences on my sleeve and you've just pointed to a big.

00:30:23.662 --> 00:30:26.362
I've never actually seen it.

00:30:26.362 --> 00:30:29.182
And James has been my thing for me to watch it.

00:30:29.182 --> 00:30:31.182
So I like this point.

00:30:31.182 --> 00:30:33.061
Maybe like what you're done.

00:30:33.061 --> 00:30:33.781
Yeah.

00:30:33.781 --> 00:30:34.642
Yeah.

00:30:34.642 --> 00:30:34.942
Yeah.

00:30:34.942 --> 00:30:39.221
Put together like a list of like like ghost ship 13 ghosts.

00:30:39.221 --> 00:30:40.481
What's another of those?

00:30:40.481 --> 00:30:44.182
There was like, was it haunting on a house?

00:30:44.182 --> 00:30:45.102
Yeah.

00:30:45.102 --> 00:30:48.622
There's like the list of these that all over like made in that same time frame.

00:30:48.622 --> 00:30:56.402
You know, they suddenly they had some new technology and that's also right in the era that they figured out how to like dice someone like in a horror movie.

00:30:56.402 --> 00:31:03.352
So it's like a lot of the first times that you can actually see like it's somebody cut in half in a way like like either vertically or sideways.

00:31:03.352 --> 00:31:05.781
Isn't that the entire intro of Ghost Ship?

00:31:05.781 --> 00:31:06.082
Yeah, yeah.

00:31:06.082 --> 00:31:12.781
They'll get from that wire off the sound percent and someone is like bisected like vertically in.

00:31:13.102 --> 00:31:14.682
in 13 ghosts.

00:31:14.682 --> 00:31:18.082
It's just like, yeah, the technology suddenly existed to do that.

00:31:18.082 --> 00:31:22.051
And every horror director within three, we got to use this man.

00:31:22.051 --> 00:31:23.221
It's like bullet time.

00:31:23.221 --> 00:31:25.221
Everybody's got to use bullet time.

00:31:25.221 --> 00:31:26.021
Yeah.

00:31:26.021 --> 00:31:26.321
Okay.

00:31:26.321 --> 00:31:34.751
So without spoiling anything, those last final, those final pages of that first issue are, in my opinion, worth the price of admission alone.

00:31:34.751 --> 00:31:36.602
Like those last like three pages are incredible.

00:31:36.602 --> 00:31:39.481
Speaking of ghosts, we got to look at ghost guts.

00:31:39.501 --> 00:31:42.701
So Christian, any explanation on who this ghost got?

00:31:42.701 --> 00:31:45.862
Ghost guts is our slimer.

00:31:45.902 --> 00:31:48.521
That's why I said yeah.

00:31:49.321 --> 00:31:50.662
Very topical.

00:31:50.662 --> 00:31:52.261
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:31:52.261 --> 00:32:01.261
It was funny because like kind of like it was a really strange the kind of the whole ghost gut thing kind of happened almost kind of accidentally.

00:32:01.261 --> 00:32:03.761
And it was just so perfect.

00:32:03.761 --> 00:32:12.041
Like so we were doing the kind of we were working on the Devil's Cup and I was just like, you know, we were talking about like, you know, what what our ghost could have looked like.

00:32:12.041 --> 00:32:12.910
And.

00:32:12.910 --> 00:32:16.150
We were sort of like talking, you know, are they going to be like interfering?

00:32:16.150 --> 00:32:18.299
So are they going to kind of like, you know, is it going to be a deal?

00:32:18.299 --> 00:32:22.750
And there was a one point I was talking about that I was going to paint the ghosts.

00:32:22.750 --> 00:32:26.539
So they were a completely different medium to the rest of the comic.

00:32:26.539 --> 00:32:29.750
But then as I was drawing them, I was just like, I just had this this thing.

00:32:29.750 --> 00:32:33.529
Well, if they're see -through, why can't we see their innards?

00:32:33.529 --> 00:32:39.390
And it was just that in the minute I drew it and I sent it to James, James was like, like, scrap everything else.

00:32:39.390 --> 00:32:40.365
That's it.

00:32:40.365 --> 00:33:16.836
It's it's the actual email was just in all caps That was the only response Yeah, it was it was one of those really kind of like and then you know and it's I can't talk about it and there's that I'm gonna kind of spoil stuff but there was there was something James put in like the scripts and when we were sort of talking about kind of like the spectrograph that it was just it just it was Perfect, then you'll find this out as you read it It'll become more and more apparent what we're actually doing with the ghost But I can promise you you have never read a ghost story like this.

00:33:16.836 --> 00:33:38.574
You have never seen ghosts like this These are really they're unlike anything you've seen and they're really fucking cool and they're really fucking Yeah, issue two is when we kick it we kick the you know now now we've set the stage now we can just scare you for a while like That's our goal.

00:33:38.693 --> 00:33:39.193
Yeah.

00:33:39.193 --> 00:33:45.874
Well, let's stick with this topic of horror, because both of you are obviously two of the premier voices in the world of horror within comics.

00:33:45.993 --> 00:33:50.624
Christian, you just finished up your Black Label book, Batman's City of Madness at DC Comics.

00:33:50.624 --> 00:33:55.673
And James, it seems like every series you write outside of Wynn has some horror element to it.

00:33:55.673 --> 00:33:58.814
Something is Killing the Children, The Deviant, which was amazing.

00:33:58.814 --> 00:34:02.433
I mean, they're all amazing, but Nice House on the Lake and now Spectrograph.

00:34:02.433 --> 00:34:04.326
James, let's start with you.

00:34:04.461 --> 00:34:10.942
Can you think back to when your love of horror like really first like that spark for horror really kicked in?

00:34:10.942 --> 00:34:15.902
I mean, a huge part of it is I thought that I hated horror when I was growing up.

00:34:15.902 --> 00:34:19.981
It was a like, you know, I always like things with a spooky aesthetic.

00:34:19.981 --> 00:34:21.722
I like drawing skeletons.

00:34:21.902 --> 00:34:25.202
I love Nightmare Before Christmas.

00:34:25.202 --> 00:34:32.822
Like it, you know, but then like once I actually came, came of age and my friends started watching scary movies, it was just like, this is too scary for me.

00:34:32.822 --> 00:34:34.286
I don't want to have nightmares.

00:34:34.286 --> 00:34:37.085
Because I had bad nightmares, like, fairly often.

00:34:37.085 --> 00:34:41.036
And, you know, and then a few things started happening, like, kind of simultaneously.

00:34:41.036 --> 00:34:49.826
Like, in late middle school, early high school, I realized that I really liked telling my nightmares to my friends, like, at sleepovers and stuff.

00:34:49.826 --> 00:34:51.485
I just, like, I like - Something that's killing the children.

00:34:51.485 --> 00:34:57.626
Oh, yeah, the opening of Something That's Killing the Children is, like - fully take, I mean down to the fact that the kid's named James.

00:34:57.626 --> 00:34:58.925
And has classes.

00:34:58.925 --> 00:35:00.096
Yeah, and has classes.

00:35:00.096 --> 00:35:01.876
Like there's always a James in my books.

00:35:01.876 --> 00:35:08.146
I'm not, like, you know, I'm not too shy about that.

00:35:08.146 --> 00:35:17.389
But there is a, there's an element of, you know, there was an element of storytelling that I really, really started to appreciate and I started to really love.

00:35:17.389 --> 00:35:22.530
But at that moment, I would still cancel on a group hangout if I found out that they were watching a horror movie.

00:35:22.530 --> 00:35:36.489
And I would like go down the aisle at Blockbuster and I wouldn't make eye contact with the VHS cases because I was like, if I looked them like straight in the eye, then I would have terrible nightmares about what I assumed the movies were about.

00:35:36.510 --> 00:35:48.670
But then like I find in late high school, I started reading Stephen King and then I started making caveats to the - Like where it was just like, I enjoyed reading horror, but I didn't like seeing horror.

00:35:48.670 --> 00:35:55.050
And then I went into college and I started writing horror.

00:35:55.050 --> 00:36:01.510
And then I, and my minor was in film studies and I just like finally decided to pull off the band aid.

00:36:01.570 --> 00:36:10.110
And you know, at Sarah Lawrence college, you basically have to write a like a full thesis paper every semester for, you know, for the courses you're in.

00:36:10.110 --> 00:36:41.326
And I like three semesters in a row, I just wrote, my theses on horror and over the course of like a year I watched about you know 250 different horror movies and it's like and then I started like understanding the different pieces of them and understanding the fact that we're never like the the stories that were in my head were much scarier often than the movies and then when the movies were actually scarier I found that really interesting and exciting and I wanted to understand why and how.

00:36:41.326 --> 00:36:49.666
And then, you know, once I connected with Scott Snyder and the two of us started writing together, both of us start from a base of horror.

00:36:49.666 --> 00:36:55.135
And it's like, and it means that it's just like, we're almost the central question that we're always asking ourselves.

00:36:55.135 --> 00:36:57.516
And when we build the new characters, what are they afraid of?

00:36:57.516 --> 00:37:02.715
And then how do you literalize their fear into something that they have to overcome over the course of the story?

00:37:02.715 --> 00:37:05.465
And it's just like, that is at the heart of every Scott Snyder story.

00:37:05.465 --> 00:37:07.576
And it's at the heart of every James Tynan story.

00:37:07.576 --> 00:37:10.253
Like we're both horror writers at our hearts.

00:37:10.253 --> 00:37:14.103
And that's how that bond was forged.

00:37:14.103 --> 00:37:16.534
And then we both brought that into superhero comics.

00:37:16.534 --> 00:37:20.534
And then I finally got around to just writing straight up horror.

00:37:20.534 --> 00:37:21.414
Christian, how about you?

00:37:21.414 --> 00:37:24.204
I know we've had you on the show now four times.

00:37:24.204 --> 00:37:26.423
How have we not talked about where your origin of horror started?

00:37:26.423 --> 00:37:27.954
I can't follow that.

00:37:27.954 --> 00:37:31.114
I just like horror.

00:37:31.114 --> 00:37:32.554
I like horror.

00:37:32.554 --> 00:37:34.373
I like monsters.

00:37:35.313 --> 00:37:36.233
Blood, blood, blood.

00:37:36.233 --> 00:37:37.550
I mean, I think kind of like...

00:37:37.550 --> 00:37:48.380
Yeah, I mean, I mean, things for me is like I like scary stuff, but I never I don't like go like girls like any horror that's like really good.

00:37:48.380 --> 00:37:50.369
I'm like, no, thank you.

00:37:50.369 --> 00:38:03.460
But I think kind of why I gravitate to those sort of stories is the kind of I think when you bring in an element of unreality to a story, there's that that's a bit more unpredictable.

00:38:03.460 --> 00:38:04.974
You don't know what's going to happen.

00:38:04.974 --> 00:38:09.333
And I find that exciting in stories like what is gonna happen?

00:38:09.333 --> 00:38:20.114
And I think kind of I gravitate towards stories where I can't predict it as easily because we are in a realm of non -reality.

00:38:20.233 --> 00:38:27.034
As far as kind of like writing goes though, I think I don't see myself as, I'm a very newbie writer.

00:38:27.034 --> 00:38:29.873
I don't really see myself as a horror writer.

00:38:29.873 --> 00:38:31.597
I kind of like.

00:38:31.597 --> 00:38:36.077
When I'm writing a story, I like to kind of think, well, what's this story about?

00:38:36.077 --> 00:38:39.878
And react to kind of things that I'm scared of or interested in.

00:38:39.878 --> 00:38:45.478
And they tend to be frightening things, you know, in the world that surround us or things that make me angry.

00:38:45.478 --> 00:38:57.297
And I think when you have something that makes you angry or that frightens you, it just naturally translates to kind of a horror because those are the emotions that you're trying to kind of deal with.

00:38:57.297 --> 00:39:01.134
And those are the kind of the conversation you're trying to have.

00:39:01.134 --> 00:39:02.384
It's about scary things.

00:39:02.384 --> 00:39:05.313
It just gravitates towards that genre.

00:39:05.474 --> 00:39:09.193
But I can look at VHS tech.

00:39:09.273 --> 00:39:10.833
Like, no problem.

00:39:10.833 --> 00:39:11.793
That's Stephen King.

00:39:11.793 --> 00:39:13.974
That's when you were younger, Christian.

00:39:13.974 --> 00:39:15.844
Well, the ghoulies.

00:39:15.844 --> 00:39:17.074
I mean, this is really old school.

00:39:17.074 --> 00:39:19.313
You guys might be a bit too young for this.

00:39:19.313 --> 00:39:19.994
There was a video.

00:39:19.994 --> 00:39:21.574
There was a horror called the ghoulies.

00:39:21.574 --> 00:39:25.038
And it's about these creatures that live in the toilet.

00:39:25.038 --> 00:39:39.547
And I always remember there was like a video shop that we used to go to, there was like a cardboard stand and it was a toilet with this thing coming out of the toilet and it used to scare, it was just like, and that used to scare the shit out of me.

00:39:39.547 --> 00:39:42.318
I was just like, I don't want to have that thing bite my bum.

00:39:43.038 --> 00:39:45.657
So yeah, the ghoulies was the exception to the rule.

00:39:45.657 --> 00:39:46.958
I didn't like that.

00:39:46.958 --> 00:39:53.027
Well, we actually just spoke about this gentleman a moment ago, but I have another clip that I want to play before we get into our next question here.

00:39:53.027 --> 00:39:54.237
So here we go.

00:39:54.733 --> 00:39:56.233
Every book has been great.

00:39:56.233 --> 00:39:59.003
Spectrograph is gonna blow your mind too, from James and Christian.

00:39:59.003 --> 00:40:00.784
I can't say enough good things about him.

00:40:00.784 --> 00:40:05.143
If you haven't picked up Spectrograph or you missed the order cut off, go get it.

00:40:05.143 --> 00:40:06.184
I'm sure it'll sell out.

00:40:06.184 --> 00:40:08.034
It's amazing, like everything he does.

00:40:08.034 --> 00:40:11.873
He's the best writer in comics and one of the best human beings on the planet.

00:40:11.873 --> 00:40:15.423
So I'm like not anything but praise for him on every level.

00:40:15.423 --> 00:40:22.454
I met him, he was my student when he was an undergrad and I was like a adjunct teacher.

00:40:22.454 --> 00:40:24.710
I was in my like, I don't know.

00:40:24.878 --> 00:40:28.478
my mid -20s and he was like, we've known each other forever.

00:40:28.478 --> 00:40:29.938
He was a child.

00:40:30.197 --> 00:40:39.177
To have your, I've said it many times, but to have your student become somebody who you learn from, who's a good teacher to you is a great feeling and he's just the best.

00:40:39.177 --> 00:40:44.557
So yeah, James, as Scott just said there, we just had, again, we had him on the show just a couple of weeks ago, but.

00:40:44.557 --> 00:40:56.077
On top of all the series that you're working on currently, some of which we didn't even list in the intro because there are just so many, you are also a founding creator of Distillery Publishing and recently started Tiny Onions Productions.

00:40:56.077 --> 00:41:05.237
You seem to be leading the pack with not only being one of the premier writers of the medium, but also among one of the savviest in terms of business when it comes to the comic industry.

00:41:05.237 --> 00:41:12.458
So my question for you is, where does that vigor come from when it comes to building your brand and your production?

00:41:13.581 --> 00:41:18.262
Well, I talk about my therapist, talk about that with my therapist like every couple of weeks.

00:41:18.262 --> 00:41:22.561
It's like, I am, I'm a workaholic.

00:41:22.561 --> 00:41:25.501
I have a, I don't know how to do less.

00:41:25.501 --> 00:41:30.501
I think I would go a little bit insane if I was only working on one project at a time.

00:41:30.501 --> 00:41:38.282
Working at, on a bunch of different titles all at once allows me to stretch all of these different muscles creatively.

00:41:38.282 --> 00:41:41.038
And then on top of that, like one of the heart.

00:41:41.038 --> 00:41:45.077
Like, one of the biggest reasons I'm in comics is how much I love comic book art.

00:41:45.077 --> 00:41:49.237
If you, like, walk around my apartment, the walls are covered in comic book art.

00:41:49.237 --> 00:41:55.447
I have, like, you know, two, three, I have three portfolios worth of, like, original art that I picked up.

00:41:55.447 --> 00:42:00.347
I am, like, like, this is, this is my deep passion, and I'm not an artist.

00:42:00.347 --> 00:42:08.590
Like, you know, I'm gonna go to a friend's figure drawing later, later today, and I'm going to draw the worst, like, sketch of my friend.

00:42:08.590 --> 00:42:18.329
that like, you know, you could possibly imagine and no one will see it because I don't even like, it's not even like jokingly, oh, it's cute how not good it is.

00:42:18.329 --> 00:42:25.568
It's like, no, no, no, this is just a, like, it looks like when I tried doing this when I was 17, cause that's when I stopped doing it.

00:42:25.750 --> 00:42:30.610
And, but I like, I love art and I love working.

00:42:30.610 --> 00:42:32.570
And then on top of that, I like solving problems.

00:42:32.570 --> 00:42:46.840
Like I went for years, I was working in and around superhero comics and there was an entire aspect of that job that was just dealing with the internal politics, like week in and week out, trying to get stories through and all of that.

00:42:46.840 --> 00:42:55.989
And the second I was kind of freed of that ecosystem and I was just able to like, just work on all of the things that I wanna work on, I was able to really tap into all of this.

00:42:55.989 --> 00:43:01.454
And then on top of that, it's just like, I have, you know, like I think you might be able to...

00:43:01.454 --> 00:43:05.304
like look at it as like issues with authority figures.

00:43:05.304 --> 00:43:07.273
So I don't like having a boss.

00:43:07.273 --> 00:43:21.284
So I very much like being like being in this role where I can effectively operate as an independent production studio, not just in, you know, not out like, like in film and TV, but also in the comic space.

00:43:21.284 --> 00:43:35.244
It's like, you know, and that's how I keep sort of describing us is that like, we, we developed a lot of these projects in-house similar to how like Christian and I like, talked about this book for years before, like, oh, this is the perfect publisher for it.

00:43:35.244 --> 00:43:48.954
Now, because I have relationships with all of these different publishers, I can sort of build the idea, like, find the right creative partner for it, and then bring it to the publisher that we think it will do the best at.

00:43:48.954 --> 00:43:51.713
And like, that is really, really great.

00:43:51.713 --> 00:43:55.054
And I love all of my publishing partners most of the time.

00:43:55.054 --> 00:44:12.385
And it is a, like, You know, and it's a fun game to play, and I enjoy doing it, and then beyond that, there's also just a very selfish element of it, which is I see how I think comics should work, and I'm gonna try it out.

00:44:12.385 --> 00:44:23.021
A lot of it is just me leaning into the sorts of stories that I love telling, and then finding other creators who lean into the same type of storytellers, and then how to, like...

00:44:23.021 --> 00:44:25.601
I need, like I work on so many different projects.

00:44:25.601 --> 00:44:29.882
I needed to build an entire infrastructure just to manage my own work.

00:44:29.882 --> 00:44:37.501
And the second it was built, you know, that's when it's just like, okay, now other people should be able to benefit from this ecosystem that I've built.

00:44:37.501 --> 00:44:41.592
And, you know, we should be able to like use all of our titles to sort of support each other.

00:44:41.592 --> 00:44:51.469
Like Tiny Onion has lots of ambitious moves that we're going to be doing over the, and you know, the benefit of like having a little cash in the bank means that like we can start.

00:44:51.469 --> 00:44:59.050
talking about ideas that I won't be able to say out loud to on a public facing podcast for three years.

00:44:59.050 --> 00:45:09.030
Which in comics is not normally the sort of, you normally don't get to think in that kind of long term planning.

00:45:09.030 --> 00:45:12.769
And it's just like, it is such a relief to be able to do that.

00:45:12.769 --> 00:45:19.469
And then on top of that, getting to start having these conversations in the Hollywood space and that we get to drive.

00:45:19.469 --> 00:45:30.487
And it's like, the new position of Tiny Onion, I was just telling Christian earlier this week, we were talking to someone very, very cool about Spectrograph and sort of pitching the entire concept.

00:45:30.487 --> 00:45:42.717
And it was just like, these are the opportunities that are now on our plate rather than just sort of handing all of the base rights off to somebody else and kind of hoping that they are gonna be proper custodians for it.

00:45:42.717 --> 00:45:48.157
At least if I'm a bad custodian to my own work, it's like, I can't blame anyone but myself.

00:45:50.157 --> 00:45:55.777
Well, kind of we kind of had like two specific questions for each of you and Christian for you.

00:45:55.777 --> 00:45:57.047
You know, we mentioned this earlier.

00:45:57.047 --> 00:46:00.657
You recently just finished up your dream project over with Batman, City of Madness.

00:46:00.657 --> 00:46:04.838
And this is maybe a slight spoiler for issue three and the series.

00:46:04.838 --> 00:46:08.338
So if you haven't read the finale of City of Madness, proceed with caution.

00:46:08.338 --> 00:46:19.438
But in the end, and this is kind of my interpretation is that we discover that the story is ultimately about the sins of our fathers and the trauma that it passes down to us as the sons, you know.

00:46:19.438 --> 00:46:25.498
And in spite of the purest intentions, the creation of Arkham Asylum drives Amadeus and his son Arthur mad.

00:46:25.498 --> 00:46:31.257
Specifically, it influences Arkham to torture his patients and summon dark magic to relieve his son's depression.

00:46:31.257 --> 00:46:34.137
That, of course, backfires on Ammon notes to Amadeus.

00:46:34.137 --> 00:46:40.018
This makes Arthur into an easy target for the darkness to create the Batman below.

00:46:40.018 --> 00:46:49.262
And with that, there's a parallel of Bruce with Alfred and how he subconsciously or otherwise trained and pushed and encouraged Bruce to eventually become the Dark Knight.

00:46:49.262 --> 00:46:53.762
so that he too could enact vengeance and seek closure for the loss of Martha and Thomas.

00:46:53.762 --> 00:46:56.661
So that's my long winded way of saying.

00:46:56.661 --> 00:46:57.862
It's really good.

00:46:57.862 --> 00:46:59.242
It's awesome.

00:46:59.242 --> 00:47:01.561
All the Eisners.

00:47:01.822 --> 00:47:08.172
But I will say that from what I've seen from the masses, the only complaint that I've seen is people say they want more.

00:47:08.172 --> 00:47:09.422
There hasn't been enough.

00:47:09.422 --> 00:47:09.762
Right.

00:47:09.762 --> 00:47:16.161
So my question for you is, in a very broad way, how do you feel about the series now that it's done and finished?

00:47:16.161 --> 00:47:21.681
I mean, you know, like, I mean, Arkham Asylum, Cirrus House, Cirrus Surf is the reason why I'm a comic book artist.

00:47:21.681 --> 00:47:23.762
That book changed me.

00:47:23.762 --> 00:47:38.782
And so to do a book that is a spiritual sequel, a love letter to that book, as I've said, Black County, I'm podcasting with you guys before, it was a huge privilege and just like one that I was very grateful for.

00:47:38.802 --> 00:47:44.333
And I have more, there's more of that world and there's more story to tell.

00:47:44.333 --> 00:47:48.713
If the fans want it and DC want it, I would love to return to it.

00:47:48.713 --> 00:47:54.114
Obviously at the end of the story, there is a bit of a twist at the end that we could explore.

00:47:54.114 --> 00:47:59.474
But if that's it, if that's all I do, I will be very happy and very grateful.

00:47:59.534 --> 00:48:01.393
I couldn't be prouder of it.

00:48:01.393 --> 00:48:07.253
Well, we got one final question before you guys get, you know, we don't want to take all your time, but we appreciate the time you spent with us.

00:48:07.253 --> 00:48:09.677
It pertains to the Dark Knight himself.

00:48:09.677 --> 00:48:18.898
As we've said, you both wrote successful runs on Batman and we think it's safe to say that the fans would love to see a continuation of both your stories in some form or another.

00:48:18.898 --> 00:48:24.157
Can we expect either of you to write the caped crusader again at some point in the future?

00:48:24.157 --> 00:48:25.697
I mean, I'll say this.

00:48:25.697 --> 00:48:28.458
There is something there is another Batman thing.

00:48:28.458 --> 00:48:29.688
Oh, there it is.

00:48:29.688 --> 00:48:30.327
Nailed it.

00:48:30.327 --> 00:48:32.088
I'm leading cool.

00:48:32.088 --> 00:48:32.898
The beat.

00:48:32.898 --> 00:48:33.777
Yeah, yeah.

00:48:33.777 --> 00:48:36.878
So it'll be a while before you you know about it.

00:48:36.878 --> 00:48:48.507
But yeah, and like I would love to do more city of brandness, but that's that's up to the gods I mean if the hardcover sells really well, you know, I'm sure DC will be up for it.

00:48:48.507 --> 00:48:48.878
Mm -hmm.

00:48:48.878 --> 00:48:53.237
Yeah, and on my end I I've spent ten years in Gotham City.

00:48:53.237 --> 00:48:57.197
I've written like over 200 Batman issues.

00:48:57.197 --> 00:49:08.161
I Don't see myself going back to Gotham in the immediate future, but it occupies an incredibly powerful part piece of my heart.

00:49:08.702 --> 00:49:14.282
And you know, like I literally I have, you know, the bat crashing through the window tattooed on my arm.

00:49:14.541 --> 00:49:18.641
When I left Detective Comics, I said I wasn't gonna go back to Gotham City.

00:49:18.641 --> 00:49:20.382
And then I was there two years later.

00:49:20.382 --> 00:49:25.842
Like it's something that there's sometimes the bat signal goes up.

00:49:25.842 --> 00:49:30.286
Like, you know, I'm never gonna say never those characters I love tremendously.

00:49:30.286 --> 00:49:47.146
But right now, I think it's more likely that if there are little aspects of the Batman mythology that I have deep fascinations with, I wouldn't be surprised if you saw me sort of twist and bend them and find a way to express them in a creator -owned series.

00:49:47.146 --> 00:49:52.985
I think you found the right guy right now to bring it to artistic life.

00:49:52.985 --> 00:49:53.536
That's right.

00:49:53.536 --> 00:49:54.096
That's right.

00:49:54.096 --> 00:49:54.574
Well...

00:49:54.574 --> 00:49:59.364
James Christian, like we said, it was just an absolute pleasure to have you both here at the same time.

00:49:59.364 --> 00:50:03.074
Just got a spectrograph and Batman and all the things.

00:50:03.074 --> 00:50:07.434
Once again, that first issue of spectrograph hit shelves on April 24th.

00:50:07.434 --> 00:50:10.893
So make sure you call up your LCS and have them added to your pool.

00:50:10.893 --> 00:50:12.313
And James, I'm going to speak to you here.

00:50:12.313 --> 00:50:21.893
We are obviously both both Aaron and I huge fans of your work and we just can't wait to see what you continue to work on both in comics and with tiny onion and everything in between.

00:50:21.893 --> 00:50:23.021
And Christian.

00:50:23.021 --> 00:50:24.262
Obviously we love you too.

00:50:24.262 --> 00:50:32.661
And we, you know that anytime that you or either one of you actually want to come on the back on the show to talk about whatever, please, like we would absolutely, we would love it.

00:50:32.661 --> 00:50:34.242
I'll be back next week.

00:50:34.242 --> 00:50:38.181
We'll pass the baton off to each one of you one more time.

00:50:38.181 --> 00:50:41.802
Is there anything you want to plug any socials, anything you want to highlight before we go?

00:50:41.802 --> 00:50:42.992
Uh, Christian, we'll start with you.

00:50:42.992 --> 00:50:46.101
Yeah, no, I'm good.

00:50:46.202 --> 00:50:48.961
It's all about, it's all about spectrograph for the moment.

00:50:48.961 --> 00:50:50.262
Yeah.

00:50:50.262 --> 00:50:51.885
I'll come back in a bit.

00:50:51.885 --> 00:50:53.726
We have more stuff, I'm sure.

00:50:53.965 --> 00:51:05.045
Yeah, like on top of Spectrograph, which you should go pick up, like Department of Truth's coming back this summer, some of my other big series that people have that have been sort of dormant for a second.

00:51:05.045 --> 00:51:07.896
You might hear some news about in the next few weeks.

00:51:07.896 --> 00:51:10.106
So keep your ears to the ground.

00:51:10.326 --> 00:51:20.557
The other thing that I, you know, after such a lovely message from my good friend and mentor, Scott Snyder, everyone should also put in their orders for White Boat.

00:51:20.557 --> 00:51:55.197
By him and Francesco Frankavia if you like horror like once again like you know Scott is the one who like taught me how to do a horror comic good and if you haven't honestly if you haven't been reading some of his creator on horror over the last few years I think they like deserve they like a huge audience like those books are just so like wickedly smart and so well put together and you know and then Like Frank, if he is fucking amazing and you should pick up the you should pick up white book.

00:51:55.197 --> 00:51:56.137
I completely agree.

00:51:56.137 --> 00:51:57.188
I will echo all that.

00:51:57.188 --> 00:51:59.838
And we just want to say once again, thank you both.

00:51:59.838 --> 00:52:00.998
Christian and James for joining us.

00:52:00.998 --> 00:52:03.268
Can't wait for people to get spectrograph in their hands.

00:52:03.268 --> 00:52:06.418
And we'd love to again have you back on the show and we'll talk to you soon.

00:52:06.418 --> 00:52:07.367
Thank you for having us.

00:52:07.367 --> 00:52:08.257
Sounds good.

00:52:08.257 --> 00:52:09.597
Have a good one.

00:52:09.597 --> 00:52:12.677
OK, there's that conversation with James and Christian.

00:52:12.677 --> 00:52:14.318
Such an honor to have both them on.

00:52:14.318 --> 00:52:16.907
Very excited for them and for the release of spectrograph.

00:52:16.907 --> 00:52:18.510
I think people are going to flock.

00:52:18.510 --> 00:52:21.190
to their local comic book shop for this first issue.

00:52:21.190 --> 00:52:22.099
Why'd you laugh at that?

00:52:22.099 --> 00:52:23.099
Why'd you laugh at my flock?

00:52:23.099 --> 00:52:23.699
I don't know.

00:52:23.699 --> 00:52:24.349
I don't know.

00:52:24.349 --> 00:52:25.610
What the, what the flock, Aaron?

00:52:25.610 --> 00:52:26.869
Yeah.

00:52:26.869 --> 00:52:29.369
Uh, but it is, it's great, Aaron.

00:52:29.369 --> 00:52:32.369
I don't, you didn't really get to talk about it much at the beginning of the show.

00:52:32.369 --> 00:52:34.190
You've got, you had a chance to respect your graph.

00:52:34.190 --> 00:52:37.769
Number one, is this something that you're going to continue on after, you know, this first issue?

00:52:37.769 --> 00:52:38.590
Absolutely.

00:52:38.590 --> 00:52:39.210
Absolutely.

00:52:39.210 --> 00:52:40.429
I am very quickly.

00:52:40.429 --> 00:52:44.494
And again, we talk about it in the episode, how like you were just.

00:52:44.494 --> 00:52:50.384
from the beginning, from the get -go, as soon as you heard about what Distillery was doing, you were an automatic supporter.

00:52:50.384 --> 00:52:58.684
I was kind of like, ah, I was a little bit hesitant, but now that I see all the stuff they're doing, also the fact that my girl, Mica Andalfo is over there doing some - She's a founding member.

00:52:58.684 --> 00:53:02.994
She's a founding member, Blasphemous is looking, you know, like I love it.

00:53:02.994 --> 00:53:04.384
So Spectrograph - You like it, it's spice.

00:53:04.384 --> 00:53:06.974
I like it, it's spice.

00:53:06.974 --> 00:53:10.134
Spectrograph, we read it, it's so good.

00:53:10.134 --> 00:53:15.541
You can hear it during the conversation, like I am - in love with this book and I cannot wait to read more.

00:53:15.541 --> 00:53:22.891
And also I don't know if I can take what's going to happen to this book because it's so like my anxiety just thinking about the book every time I think about it is like peaked.

00:53:22.891 --> 00:53:30.152
And we need to give you a huge kudos as well because you made a great connection between 13 ghosts and James admit you just heard it.

00:53:30.152 --> 00:53:37.862
He admitted that that was a major influence for him in this story, which Aaron, I got to give you kudos when it happened that I didn't make that connection.

00:53:37.862 --> 00:53:40.206
I've obviously seen 13 ghosts and I like it, but.

00:53:40.206 --> 00:53:44.775
It didn't dawn on me as I was reading Spectrograph number one that that was a big influence for James.

00:53:44.775 --> 00:53:50.465
Yeah, if there's one thing you can count on me, it's a movie references and pleasuring yourself and pleasuring myself.

00:53:50.465 --> 00:53:57.365
But yeah, and like I said before, we unfortunately did not get to talk to Christian a ton about City of Madness.

00:53:57.365 --> 00:54:01.005
Don't you worry, we will have Christian back on the show.

00:54:01.005 --> 00:54:02.266
I have no doubt about that.

00:54:02.266 --> 00:54:08.494
And if you want to listen to Christian and your, you know, handsome hosts here talk about.

00:54:08.494 --> 00:54:10.153
Batman's City of Madness.

00:54:10.153 --> 00:54:15.893
I mean, go back to our recent episode where we actually talked to Christian about Batman City of Madness.

00:54:15.893 --> 00:54:24.853
And, you know, we kind of run it all down there and then we'll have him back once the I believe once the trade comes out, I'm sure we'll have him back because God, he's talking about hard covers.

00:54:24.853 --> 00:54:26.443
Oh, you're getting hard off hard cover.

00:54:26.443 --> 00:54:26.833
Yeah.

00:54:26.833 --> 00:54:28.094
Oh, yeah.

00:54:28.253 --> 00:54:29.244
It's hard cover comes out.

00:54:29.244 --> 00:54:30.793
Yeah, it's a good looking book, man.

00:54:30.793 --> 00:54:32.344
It's the hard cover comes out in October.

00:54:32.344 --> 00:54:34.684
So we'll actually be at we'll be at New York Comic Con.

00:54:34.684 --> 00:54:36.494
And we're trying everybody.

00:54:36.494 --> 00:54:39.273
Please send us your spirit energy like Dragon Ball Z.

00:54:39.273 --> 00:54:45.634
Send us all of your energy because we are trying to get Christian at New York Comic Con and it'll be a it'll be a big deal.

00:54:45.634 --> 00:54:46.853
So oh, he oh, he coming.

00:54:46.853 --> 00:54:47.594
He coming for sure.

00:54:47.594 --> 00:54:48.574
He coming.

00:54:48.574 --> 00:54:51.134
I got to fly over there, pick his ass up, bring him back.

00:54:51.134 --> 00:54:51.653
He come.

00:54:51.653 --> 00:54:52.324
Yeah, that's right.

00:54:52.324 --> 00:54:54.534
And then also like to kind of speak up what you're saying there.

00:54:54.534 --> 00:55:00.344
And we've had Christian on the show now four times and we've talked to him about Batman, City of Madness all four times.

00:55:00.344 --> 00:55:04.525
So it's like we can't not talk about at least once, but.

00:55:04.525 --> 00:55:08.056
I will say, I think the first time we had him on, the city of madness was not a real thing.

00:55:08.056 --> 00:55:10.085
It was just an image that he was posting on Twitter.

00:55:10.085 --> 00:55:13.916
The second time it had just been announced and it was with Patrick Reynolds, right?

00:55:13.916 --> 00:55:15.925
That's when they were doing bloodstained teeth.

00:55:15.925 --> 00:55:20.925
And then the third time was during our New York city interview, a thon or kiss face.

00:55:20.925 --> 00:55:25.655
And that entire conversation was just Batman's city of madness issue number one.

00:55:25.655 --> 00:55:27.126
And he was at New York that week as well.

00:55:27.126 --> 00:55:32.878
It was weird hanging out with him and then also releasing an episode with him that we had recorded like a month prior.

00:55:32.878 --> 00:55:36.478
And it's episode 132 in case anybody's wondering.

00:55:36.478 --> 00:55:40.297
And then, of course, this episode here, we got one question in and we were hurrying.

00:55:40.297 --> 00:55:44.557
I'm sure you probably heard it in our voice was like, Father issues, problems.

00:55:44.557 --> 00:55:45.358
What were your thoughts?

00:55:45.358 --> 00:55:47.498
Like it was hard to get everything out.

00:55:47.498 --> 00:55:47.717
Love.

00:55:47.717 --> 00:55:47.958
Yeah.

00:55:47.958 --> 00:55:50.228
So great conversation.

00:55:50.228 --> 00:55:53.998
I'm excited how this I'm very excited by how this conversation turned out.

00:55:53.998 --> 00:55:57.677
I'm glad that we were everyone was here and it's just it's awesome.

00:55:57.677 --> 00:56:01.018
So thank you all so much for being here for episode one fifty three.

00:56:01.018 --> 00:56:02.670
Aaron, next week on the show.

00:56:02.670 --> 00:56:18.269
We are going to take a quick pause from the interview train and we're going to get, um, actually I don't have a good, I don't have a good pun for this, but you might, uh, we're going to the Sonic universe, uh, over at Paramount plus we're going to be reviewing the entire series of knuckles.

00:56:18.269 --> 00:56:19.429
Knuckles.

00:56:20.050 --> 00:56:21.750
Knuckles.

00:56:21.849 --> 00:56:27.690
Now I think it probably goes without saying, but I'm going to say it anyway here live on the show.

00:56:27.690 --> 00:56:31.309
If it were up to me, we wouldn't be talking about the series at all.

00:56:31.309 --> 00:56:34.559
But my good friend, Aaron Knowles is a pretty big Sonic fan.

00:56:34.559 --> 00:56:35.449
Wait, did I?

00:56:35.449 --> 00:56:37.079
No, uh -uh.

00:56:37.079 --> 00:56:38.320
I don't think I picked.

00:56:38.320 --> 00:56:39.550
Did I pick this?

00:56:39.550 --> 00:56:40.269
No, you did not.

00:56:40.269 --> 00:56:41.710
I'm just trying to anticipate your needs.

00:56:41.710 --> 00:56:42.469
I love you.

00:56:42.469 --> 00:56:42.800
OK.

00:56:42.800 --> 00:56:43.090
Yeah.

00:56:43.090 --> 00:56:44.239
Did you want to talk about it?

00:56:44.239 --> 00:56:49.409
You know, I think it's I'm as an aegis, Elvis Stan.

00:56:49.409 --> 00:56:52.269
Let's do it.

00:56:52.269 --> 00:56:53.309
OK, good.

00:56:53.309 --> 00:56:54.480
We can switch it up if you want.

00:56:54.480 --> 00:56:56.230
I mean, it's it's only six episodes.

00:56:56.230 --> 00:56:57.039
It looks good.

00:56:57.039 --> 00:56:58.190
Like the trailer has already come out.

00:56:58.190 --> 00:56:59.726
It looks it looks silly.

00:56:59.726 --> 00:57:01.465
Well, yeah, I mean, Sonic is silly.

00:57:01.465 --> 00:57:05.025
Sonic, you know, I'm going to eat chili dogs the entire time.

00:57:05.025 --> 00:57:06.795
What is remind me?

00:57:06.795 --> 00:57:08.425
What is what is Knuckles?

00:57:08.425 --> 00:57:09.246
Is he a kid?

00:57:09.246 --> 00:57:09.646
No, a kid.

00:57:09.646 --> 00:57:10.025
Yeah.

00:57:10.025 --> 00:57:10.596
Yeah.

00:57:10.596 --> 00:57:10.985
Yeah.

00:57:10.985 --> 00:57:14.266
I pulled that from the recesses of my my dark nerd brain.

00:57:14.266 --> 00:57:15.726
I went down to the archives.

00:57:15.726 --> 00:57:17.746
I mean, you can't lie.

00:57:17.746 --> 00:57:23.646
And anybody I want to hear anybody's arguments to tell me that the Sonic movies are not good.

00:57:23.646 --> 00:57:25.346
Yeah, they're yeah, they're really fun.

00:57:25.346 --> 00:57:27.166
Like they're they remember.

00:57:27.166 --> 00:57:29.581
So let's just kind of go back because we've actually reviewed.

00:57:29.581 --> 00:57:31.362
both Sonic movies on the show.

00:57:31.362 --> 00:57:34.641
I think the first Sonic was maybe one of our first 25 episodes.

00:57:34.641 --> 00:57:36.581
And then we reviewed the second one, of course.

00:57:36.581 --> 00:57:47.521
And I remember thinking as we were doing, I'm like, yeah, I mean, we're covering because, you know, you're the big video game fan and, you know, we're trying to we're trying to cover all of our bases here with movies and video games and comics and everything.

00:57:47.521 --> 00:57:56.782
So going into it, we had that big backlash, you know, the the CGI of Sonic, the first look, everyone lost their fucking minds and they changed it.

00:57:56.782 --> 00:57:58.702
And it's been Rosie and.

00:57:58.702 --> 00:58:01.802
Sprinkles and skipping ever since it's been great.

00:58:01.802 --> 00:58:02.692
The movies have been fun.

00:58:02.692 --> 00:58:18.202
Jim Carrey is killing it And from my understanding Aaron, I don't know if you've heard this or not But it sounds like Jim Carrey is gonna be back for the the initial or the eventual third one with shadow Yeah, I think cuz didn't yeah, there was a there was like a When it was we didn't see a body and you know the rule you don't see a body.

00:58:18.202 --> 00:58:24.612
You don't see a body Just like fucking what's her name Scarlet Witch that bitch ain't dead All right, we're getting off on a tangent here.

00:58:24.612 --> 00:58:30.581
Anyway, we're gonna be talking about knuckles And actually, I think Aaron, that'll be the week that we go to C2E2.

00:58:30.581 --> 00:58:35.061
So we're gonna have, that could possibly be an in -person review.

00:58:35.121 --> 00:58:37.362
So be on the lookout for that one.

00:58:37.362 --> 00:58:39.461
Might be naked.

00:58:39.461 --> 00:58:40.431
You'll never know.

00:58:40.431 --> 00:58:43.460
And the thing is, as you're listening, you'll have no idea.

00:58:43.460 --> 00:58:43.942
You'll have no idea.

00:58:43.942 --> 00:58:45.981
I'm just gonna hear this.

00:58:46.922 --> 00:58:48.822
And then we'll let you guess what that was.

00:58:48.822 --> 00:58:50.501
And then you'll know.

00:58:54.349 --> 00:59:06.429
All right, we're gonna get out of episode 153 Aaron take us out of here I love this show Subscribe to our podcast Apple podcast Spotify YouTube audible.

00:59:06.429 --> 00:59:22.769
I heart radio wherever you listen your favorite podcast Thank you to our pay Thank you to our picks by the way, just everyone's aware just to clear the air Oh, it's getting rowdy.

00:59:22.769 --> 00:59:24.090
Uh, thank you to our haters.

00:59:24.090 --> 00:59:26.469
Alex, Alice, Aaron, simmer down.

00:59:26.469 --> 00:59:27.869
Aaron, bought it from short box.

00:59:27.869 --> 00:59:30.550
Brad B, Cassidy, Chris, from the bottom of the pod.

00:59:30.550 --> 00:59:33.449
Chris J, Christie, David, Elliot, George, Greg from first -generation club.

00:59:33.449 --> 00:59:41.219
Haley, hams six, Jake from speck tales, Jake S, Jeremy, Kenny, Kyle, Losey, Mac, Miles, Mike, Robert, Sean, Travis, and Brad, Lisa, of Combo with Couples, counseling.

00:59:41.219 --> 00:59:42.409
Boom.

00:59:43.150 --> 00:59:45.949
Follow us on social media, Facebook, Instagram.

00:59:49.293 --> 00:59:53.853
Follow us on social media Facebook Instagram, TikTok, blue sky threads oblivion bar pod.

00:59:53.853 --> 00:59:55.574
I think we're back on Twitter also.

00:59:55.574 --> 00:59:57.253
Yeah, we're back on Twitter.

00:59:57.253 --> 00:59:58.643
Everybody damn it.

00:59:58.643 --> 01:00:01.414
But omnibus for sponsoring the show.

01:00:01.414 --> 01:00:04.143
Use the link in our show notes to upgrade how you read comic books digitally.

01:00:04.143 --> 01:00:07.974
Official merch of the show can be found on our website at oblivion bar podcast .com.

01:00:07.974 --> 01:00:10.173
Thank you, Kevin Siegler for all of our oblivion bar art.

01:00:10.173 --> 01:00:11.733
He's at the Zig zone on Instagram.

01:00:11.733 --> 01:00:14.233
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01:00:14.233 --> 01:00:15.974
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01:00:15.974 --> 01:00:18.318
Thank you, fantasy shop for sponsoring the show.

01:00:18.318 --> 01:00:26.177
Last but not least, do not forget to tip your bartender 20 % or more.

01:00:26.898 --> 01:00:28.168
All right.

01:00:28.168 --> 01:00:29.547
I don't know.

01:00:29.547 --> 01:00:33.277
I don't know if that on that's going to be an ongoing thing on the show.

01:00:33.277 --> 01:00:34.838
It should not.

01:00:34.838 --> 01:00:36.418
But yeah.

01:00:36.418 --> 01:00:37.507
All right, everybody.

01:00:37.507 --> 01:00:38.248
Thank you so much.

01:00:38.248 --> 01:00:44.653
See, this is what happens when we get so wound tight for these big interviews like with James Tynan, who is the biggest.

01:00:44.653 --> 01:00:52.503
Writer in comics and Christian Ward our good friend and also incredibly talented and one of the best artists in the industry himself The moment we get done with it.

01:00:52.503 --> 01:00:58.673
We're like All right, buddy that'll do it for episode 153.

01:00:58.673 --> 01:00:59.534
Thank you so much for listening.

01:00:59.534 --> 01:01:02.684
We will see you next week for episode 154